Sulcata staying in his cave all day

Gwenamy

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Jul 17, 2020
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Windsor
HI everyone.
Django is an 8-year-old male Sulcata that I adopted as a surrender from a reptile rescue 2 years ago. So far, he has tripled in size and although his shell still shows the early pyramiding that he had when he first came home, his shell growth since then is flat. The past week, he has stopped going outside to graze, and has chosen to stay in his cave on his heating pad most of the day. He usually loves to go outside and walk around our 1/2 acre backyard and graze and dig, so this is different behavior and I am concerned. We are in the North Bay, California, so I am wondering if this is normal behavior since we had a heat wave for a couple of weeks that cooled down to normal temps - in the seventies - could this have sent his body into a brumation phase? Should I leave him be or try to get him to go outside and play?
 

Gwenamy

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Windsor
What is the temp in his night house? Kane mat? Any other heat source?
Hi Tom
He has the ReptiTherm extra large 18x18 reptile heating mat in his cave. The box says it heats at 85 degrees which is minimum /good for nighttime temperature i think/hope.
His other heat source is the sun during the day and his enclosure gets sun all day long with a couple of shady spots for him to get out of it and of course the yard where he can roam around.
I am in the process of using your schematics to have an actual insulated night box built as he is outgrowing his enclosure. For now, I insulate the box at night using a combination of plexiglass and heavy duty shower curtains layered over it. He can climb out two different ways and normally does so regularly. I noticed that he was digging a cave and I Had to pull him out of it a couple of times at night time to put him back in his enclosure for his own safety. So my number one priority is getting him an enclosure built that he can walk into and out of on his own. He can get out of this one but he has trouble finding his way back in so I have to find him and put him back in at night. I wonder if I upset him by pulling him out of his hole but I was concerned about raccoons or rats at night.
I have been pricing pig mats as the next step for a heating mat for him and any recommendations you have are completely and totally welcome. He is a very cool dude and of course I want to make sure that he is happy.
 

Gwenamy

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I forgot to attach these photos to my original reply. Here is his reptile heater, his enclosure, a close-up of his night cave which I had to Jerry rig using plywood and cinderblocks because he outgrew the biggest one I could find at the pet store and there he is underneath his shady spot in his enclosure.
 

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Tom

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Hi Tom
He has the ReptiTherm extra large 18x18 reptile heating mat in his cave. The box says it heats at 85 degrees which is minimum /good for nighttime temperature i think/hope.
His other heat source is the sun during the day and his enclosure gets sun all day long with a couple of shady spots for him to get out of it and of course the yard where he can roam around.
I am in the process of using your schematics to have an actual insulated night box built as he is outgrowing his enclosure. For now, I insulate the box at night using a combination of plexiglass and heavy duty shower curtains layered over it. He can climb out two different ways and normally does so regularly. I noticed that he was digging a cave and I Had to pull him out of it a couple of times at night time to put him back in his enclosure for his own safety. So my number one priority is getting him an enclosure built that he can walk into and out of on his own. He can get out of this one but he has trouble finding his way back in so I have to find him and put him back in at night. I wonder if I upset him by pulling him out of his hole but I was concerned about raccoons or rats at night.
I have been pricing pig mats as the next step for a heating mat for him and any recommendations you have are completely and totally welcome. He is a very cool dude and of course I want to make sure that he is happy.
He's getting much too cold at night. A heat mat alone is not enough, even in a well built insulated box. In the type of sleeping quarters you've got, his body is getting cold and he's breathing cold night air. The surface temp of the mat claimed by the manufacturer has nothing to do with air temp inside the tortoises sleeping area.

He is likely on is way to a respiratory infection if he doesn't have one already. He needs to be 80 or higher at night, and he needs to be able to warm up during the day. What happens on cooler days like what we've been having? How does he get warm when its over cast? When they don't want to eat, it is usually because they are too cold.
 

Gwenamy

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Windsor
He's getting much too cold at night. A heat mat alone is not enough, even in a well built insulated box. In the type of sleeping quarters you've got, his body is getting cold and he's breathing cold night air. The surface temp of the mat claimed by the manufacturer has nothing to do with air temp inside the tortoises sleeping area.

He is likely on is way to a respiratory infection if he doesn't have one already. He needs to be 80 or higher at night, and he needs to be able to warm up during the day. What happens on cooler days like what we've been having? How does he get warm when its over cast? When they don't want to eat, it is usually because they are too cold.
Ok. What do I use to keep the enclosure warmer at night that isn’t going to burn his shell?
 

Gwenamy

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Ok. What do I use to keep the enclosure warmer at night that isn’t going to burn his shell?
Ok. What do I use to keep the enclosure warmer at night that isn’t going to burn his shell?
ALSO, i CHECKED THE MAT AND IT SAYS THE TEMP doesn't go below 85 or higher than 118. I will get a reptile thermometer in there and get an accurate reading for the enclosure. He does eat, he just hasn't voluntarily left his cave to climb out and forage for the last week. Sounds like I need another heat source so recommendations are appreciated.
 

KarenSoCal

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Hi!
Your heat mat temps as advertised are for the mat itself. Mats don't do much for heating the air space above them.

What you need is a heat source above your tort that, like you said, won't burn his shell. The solution is a radiant heat panel (RHP) that is mounted on the ceiling or wall of his night box. It, and the mat, go onto a thermostat that turns them on/off according to the temp you set the t'stat at, usually around 80° or so.

Along with the schematic of Tom's night box, there are a couple other threads. Just in case you didn't see them, I'll link them here.




And this is a link to an RHP.


BTW, Will at Kapidolo Farms is a member here. His dried organic food items are excellent amendments to grocery store greens in winter.
 

Gwenamy

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Joined
Jul 17, 2020
Messages
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Location (City and/or State)
Windsor
Hi!
Your heat mat temps as advertised are for the mat itself. Mats don't do much for heating the air space above them.

What you need is a heat source above your tort that, like you said, won't burn his shell. The solution is a radiant heat panel (RHP) that is mounted on the ceiling or wall of his night box. It, and the mat, go onto a thermostat that turns them on/off according to the temp you set the t'stat at, usually around 80° or so.

Along with the schematic of Tom's night box, there are a couple other threads. Just in case you didn't see them, I'll link them here.




And this is a link to an RHP.


BTW, Will at Kapidolo Farms is a member here. His dried organic food items are excellent amendments to grocery store greens in winter.
thank you Karen! I will check out the links. Do you have a source for the RHP that you recommend?
 

Laura W

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Nov 30, 2020
Messages
4
Location (City and/or State)
Southern CA
We use an Oil Radiant heater on a thermostat behind cinder blocks in our big guys den. We bought it from Amazon and it has been amazing even with snow. His house is fully insulated with 3" foam board and caulked to keep heat in with a Govee that goes to my phone so I can check temps inside. His entrance has a three layers of heavy door mat with overlapping cuts for him to get in and out.

I'm around Joshua Tree and we have had similar weather happening. Mine comes out to eat but returns to his heated house soon after. He isn't a fan of anything less than 75.
 

Luzmary Holt

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Joined
Oct 11, 2020
Messages
25
Location (City and/or State)
Camarillo
HI everyone.
Django is an 8-year-old male Sulcata that I adopted as a surrender from a reptile rescue 2 years ago. So far, he has tripled in size and although his shell still shows the early pyramiding that he had when he first came home, his shell growth since then is flat. The past week, he has stopped going outside to graze, and has chosen to stay in his cave on his heating pad most of the day. He usually loves to go outside and walk around our 1/2 acre backyard and graze and dig, so this is different behavior and I am concerned. We are in the North Bay, California, so I am wondering if this is normal behavior since we had a heat wave for a couple of weeks that cooled down to normal temps - in the seventies - could this have sent his body into a brumation phase? Should I leave him be or try to get him to go outside and play?
Hi Gwenamy; I live in SoCal and have a 4 year old sulcate he roams around my back yard all day, except when it's cold, he will stay in his house for two, three, four and sometimes five days without eating or drinking, I do not worry anymore as he does come out when the whether is warmer and eats a lot! I'm not sure about your heating pad I read that it's not the best, but if he is ok and you are ok with it I suppose it's fine. I use a heating lamp. Mine (Tortellini) has a little bit of pyramiding, what have you done to revers it or stop it, I would appreciate your input. Good luck with Django
Kind regards
Luzmary
 

Tom

The Dog Trainer
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Messages
63,269
Location (City and/or State)
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Hi Gwenamy; I live in SoCal and have a 4 year old sulcate he roams around my back yard all day, except when it's cold, he will stay in his house for two, three, four and sometimes five days without eating or drinking, I do not worry anymore as he does come out when the whether is warmer and eats a lot! I'm not sure about your heating pad I read that it's not the best, but if he is ok and you are ok with it I suppose it's fine. I use a heating lamp. Mine (Tortellini) has a little bit of pyramiding, what have you done to revers it or stop it, I would appreciate your input. Good luck with Django
Kind regards
Luzmary
Heat lamps shouldn't be used over larger tortoises living outside. You'll slow burn the top of the carapace and still not warm them enough at the core or on the bottom. Heat mats, in combination with over head radiant heat panels set on a thermostat indie an insulted and sealed night box are what you need. Click the links left by Karen in post number 10 above.
 

Gwenamy

New Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2020
Messages
17
Location (City and/or State)
Windsor
We use an Oil Radiant heater on a thermostat behind cinder blocks in our big guys den. We bought it from Amazon and it has been amazing even with snow. His house is fully insulated with 3" foam board and caulked to keep heat in with a Govee that goes to my phone so I can check temps inside. His entrance has a three layers of heavy door mat with overlapping cuts for him to get in and out.

I'm around Joshua Tree and we have had similar weather happening. Mine comes out to eat but returns to his heated house soon after. He isn't a fan of anything less than 75.
Hi Laura! thanks so much. This is making more sense - it has been in the low 70s here, after a heat wave, so everything (and all the advice) is pointing to him not being warm enough. I love the radiant heater behind the cinder blocks idea - and the phone app - OMG!!!! that;s great! I need the phone app. Can you post a photo of the device and the name of the app?
I ordered another heat mat, a multi-outlet heavy duty extension cord, and while I am waiting for the new mat I put his old mat (smaller one that I have in our evacuation kit in the garage) in his cave as a secondary heat source so he would have the radiant heat coming down on him instead of just being on the heat mat underneath him. The old mat has a built in thermometer so I am monitoring the temps.
This Summer's project is building him an actual night box as I've jerry-rigged his accommodations since he outgrew everything I built in the 2 years we've had him. If I had known about this forum I would have done it right the first time and I wouldn't have to be re-doing everything! Ah well, live and learn! Thanks for your help!
 

Laura W

New Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2020
Messages
4
Location (City and/or State)
Southern CA
Hi Laura! thanks so much. This is making more sense - it has been in the low 70s here, after a heat wave, so everything (and all the advice) is pointing to him not being warm enough. I love the radiant heater behind the cinder blocks idea - and the phone app - OMG!!!! that;s great! I need the phone app. Can you post a photo of the device and the name of the app?
I ordered another heat mat, a multi-outlet heavy duty extension cord, and while I am waiting for the new mat I put his old mat (smaller one that I have in our evacuation kit in the garage) in his cave as a secondary heat source so he would have the radiant heat coming down on him instead of just being on the heat mat underneath him. The old mat has a built in thermometer so I am monitoring the temps.
This Summer's project is building him an actual night box as I've jerry-rigged his accommodations since he outgrew everything I built in the 2 years we've had him. If I had known about this forum I would have done it right the first time and I wouldn't have to be re-doing everything! Ah well, live and learn! Thanks for your help!


Links: VIVOSUN Digital Heat Mat Thermostat Temperature Controller 40–108 ºF for Seedlings, Germination, Rooting, Fermentation and Reptiles
Timer https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B015F4VFGI/?tag=exoticpetnetw-20 Govee Wireless Thermometer Hygrometer, Mini Bluetooth Humidity Sensor with Notification Alert, Data Storage and Export, 328 Feet Connecting Range https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07R586J37/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o08_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 Heater but it's not on Amazon anymore so just google it. NewAir AH-400 Space Heater, Small, White

 
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