I have been baby sitting two Sulcata tortoises for about a year and a half. Based on a little internet researching over the last few days it looks like I have not been feeding them very well. I give them Lots of escarole, some endive, dandelion greens, Romaine, Banana, Squash, Cactus (prickly pear), a little fruit like watermelon, apples, and peaches. They are sorely lacking the grasses they apparently need; so I need to work on that. They are about 14 to 15 inches long (shell only). I am going to look this evening and see if I can identify gender but based on something my son and I saw a few months ago we are pretty sure at least one of them is a male (and a very lucky male at that). They have both dug their own burrows and will not go into the others. It looks like bottom of the burrows go at least a few feet deep and I can only guess they are at least five to eight feet long. Does anyone know how long and deep I can expect the holes to get?
Sulcata burrows
- Thread starter fowlepa
- Start date
- Status
Are your house guests outside? Surely there must be some grass or weeds they can munch on outside??
The diet you are providing for them sounds pretty good, although a little fruit heavy. Desert type tortoises don't get much opportunity for fruit in the wild, and so we should not offer them too much fruit in captivity. To your list, you can add turnip greens and any other dark, leafy greens, including the packaged Spring Mix.
As for the burrow...you are in Southern Calif, right? So the winters don't get too cold in your area? Sulcatas don't hibernate, so they have to be kept warm during the winter. If you provide them with a nice, safe and secure house to go into at night, chances are they won't dig a burrow. So since yours have dug burrows, I can only assume there wasn't a house for them to go into. In the wild, a sulcata burrow is a huge thing. It goes down deep, then turns left or right, so you can't see the bottom. Once they have it to their liking, they usually don't make it any deeper. But, if you would rather they not have a burrow, then find a couple nice dog houses, insulate them, place them in the shade and try to encourage the tortoises to use the dog houses instead of the burrow. Then collapse the burrows and every time you see them start on another "dig" fill it up and place them in the dog house. During the winter, you will have to find a way to heat the dog houses so that the tortoises don't get any colder than about 55 degrees at night. Warmer is even better.
Yvonne
Oh, and:
to the forum!! Do you have pictures of the sulcatas you can share with us?
The diet you are providing for them sounds pretty good, although a little fruit heavy. Desert type tortoises don't get much opportunity for fruit in the wild, and so we should not offer them too much fruit in captivity. To your list, you can add turnip greens and any other dark, leafy greens, including the packaged Spring Mix.
As for the burrow...you are in Southern Calif, right? So the winters don't get too cold in your area? Sulcatas don't hibernate, so they have to be kept warm during the winter. If you provide them with a nice, safe and secure house to go into at night, chances are they won't dig a burrow. So since yours have dug burrows, I can only assume there wasn't a house for them to go into. In the wild, a sulcata burrow is a huge thing. It goes down deep, then turns left or right, so you can't see the bottom. Once they have it to their liking, they usually don't make it any deeper. But, if you would rather they not have a burrow, then find a couple nice dog houses, insulate them, place them in the shade and try to encourage the tortoises to use the dog houses instead of the burrow. Then collapse the burrows and every time you see them start on another "dig" fill it up and place them in the dog house. During the winter, you will have to find a way to heat the dog houses so that the tortoises don't get any colder than about 55 degrees at night. Warmer is even better.
Yvonne
Oh, and:
to the forum!! Do you have pictures of the sulcatas you can share with us?
emysemys said:
Sorry, it looks like I am messing this up and have reposted your reply, and thank you for your reply. Yes they are indeed outside and there is a bit of grass. However, I haven't watered it much and they have eaten or trampled the majority of it. Also based on what I have read over the past few days they should not be on moist ground so watering the grass very often may be a problem for them. I agree on the fruit, too much, I will cut way back on that. They go through 6 to 10 heads of lettuce a week most of witch is escarole. Today I fed them a bunch of dandelion greens and a chunk of banana, squash. I also have grape vines so they can munch on the leaves but don’t often do that. You are correct again, I am in Huntington Beach CA and as I said they do live out side and have since they where left at my home. They did fine last winter, staying in their burrows during the cold weather. I don't have any problems with their digging; it's kind of neat have what looks like GIANT GOFER HOLES in the yard. I am just curious about how far they will go as they have been digging for months now. I am keeping my eyes open for a way to send a remote controlled video camera into the holes. I would like so start growing the preferred grazing vegetation for two reasons dietary and the root structure for additional support of the burrows. I am just a bit concerned about always having moist dirt.
M
Maggie Cummings
Guest
Do you have a smaller not chain type of grocery store where you can talk to the produce people and see if they can give you the old stuff and the stuff that's too crappy to sell? That's what I do and I haven't had to pay for tortoise food for a couple of years now. They save their 'trimmings' for me. I get 2 big boxes on Sunday and another on Tuesday or Wednesday...
I also walk around and collect weeds for them and grape leafs. I can't believe your's don't eat the grape leafs, Bob loves them. I have a large grape arbor close to me and I cut several vines every day. Here's a couple of pictures of the inside of my refrigerator. All you can see is tortoise food and the top shelf has food for my aquatics and my box turtles. They also give me the cantaloupe for free and I collect blackberrie for free. So I have some 27 or so chelonia and the only food money I spend is on superworms for the box turtles, I also collect night crawlers in my garden for the aquatics. I don't pay a dime for tortoise food...This is food from the produce people given to me for free. The Mt Dew is mine but that's all...oh, and Max the crazy person
Also...there's nothing wrong with them being on moist ground I believe they are big enough. My big Sulcata goes outside for a bit then goes back in and warms up, then goes back outside again. It was raining for most of the day today and I saw him outside several different times. It was 68 degrees for most of the day. You can trust them to know when they are cold and to go back inside. BUT...BUT...they need a hot basking light to warm up under. I'm not sure about them only having burrows to get warm. How does that work Yvonne? If they get cold and wet, it doesn't seem right that then they would just have a burrow to get warm...What am I missing here? I think they need a hot basking light, don't they?
I also walk around and collect weeds for them and grape leafs. I can't believe your's don't eat the grape leafs, Bob loves them. I have a large grape arbor close to me and I cut several vines every day. Here's a couple of pictures of the inside of my refrigerator. All you can see is tortoise food and the top shelf has food for my aquatics and my box turtles. They also give me the cantaloupe for free and I collect blackberrie for free. So I have some 27 or so chelonia and the only food money I spend is on superworms for the box turtles, I also collect night crawlers in my garden for the aquatics. I don't pay a dime for tortoise food...This is food from the produce people given to me for free. The Mt Dew is mine but that's all...oh, and Max the crazy person
Also...there's nothing wrong with them being on moist ground I believe they are big enough. My big Sulcata goes outside for a bit then goes back in and warms up, then goes back outside again. It was raining for most of the day today and I saw him outside several different times. It was 68 degrees for most of the day. You can trust them to know when they are cold and to go back inside. BUT...BUT...they need a hot basking light to warm up under. I'm not sure about them only having burrows to get warm. How does that work Yvonne? If they get cold and wet, it doesn't seem right that then they would just have a burrow to get warm...What am I missing here? I think they need a hot basking light, don't they?
You asked about how deep they will burrow?
I have a personal friend that has 2, one of which is a rescue that is missing a front leg and in it's place has a wheel.
They are both around 15", so good size but not huge (yet).
They don't have a house, so they have dug a rather large burrow, and they are on almost 2 acres of land.
The one with the wheel hadn't been seen for a few days, so the search started.
After sending people (small adults) in with ropes tied to them, the end was still not in sight.
A remote control 4x4 monster truck was rigged with a camera and a 25' cord and hooked up to a lap top.
The missing tortoise was alive and well, but his wheel was stuck.
The digging began (by hand) and at approx 18' from the opening of the burrow and approx 7' deep he was recovered.
I recommend a house.
I have a personal friend that has 2, one of which is a rescue that is missing a front leg and in it's place has a wheel.
They are both around 15", so good size but not huge (yet).
They don't have a house, so they have dug a rather large burrow, and they are on almost 2 acres of land.
The one with the wheel hadn't been seen for a few days, so the search started.
After sending people (small adults) in with ropes tied to them, the end was still not in sight.
A remote control 4x4 monster truck was rigged with a camera and a 25' cord and hooked up to a lap top.
The missing tortoise was alive and well, but his wheel was stuck.
The digging began (by hand) and at approx 18' from the opening of the burrow and approx 7' deep he was recovered.
I recommend a house.
In the desert, allowing your tortoises to live in their burrows would be fine, however, here in California we get too much rain for them to be allowed to stay down there during the winter. I would suggest that in September when they are both above ground, block off the burrow entrances so they can't get back down there and that way they have to use their heated houses. If they are allowed to get wet when the weather is cold, chances are good they will get an upper respiratory infection. I think you were just lucky last winter. Allowing them to use the burrows during the summer, even with watering the grass, is fine, because its not cold.
Yvonne
OMG! What an inventive way to check on the tortoise! Thanks for posting that.
Yvonne
Yvonne
CGKeith said:
OMG! What an inventive way to check on the tortoise! Thanks for posting that.
Yvonne
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2009
- Messages
- 1,601
What sort of soil do they have there? Can't imagine them being able to did that there here in the PNW...
M
Maggie Cummings
Guest
CGKeith...this is Mildred, also a Gopherus agassizii and as you can see, also missing a front leg. After trying several different things I found what worked best for her was to glue a furniture slide onto her plastron. Wheels get stuck too many different places and are too hard for the tort to use on uneven ground, This slide works good and my other idea was to cut a billiard ball in half and use that, but the ball was too hard to cut. So we settled on the slide and it worked really well. You might suggest that to your friends for that tortoise...just trying to help...
sorry it's blurry, older camera
sorry it's blurry, older camera
Welcome to the group! Sounds like you're off to a great start, but good to hear you want to improve. Glad you joined us. We love pictures, so post away. 
I agree to cut out the fruits. I would say no fruit except the occasional cactus treat. Squash is a once a week or less type of food, although good for them. They love the blooms if you can get those. There are lots of options for food it doesn't appear you are exploring, such as scattering seeds in the yard. You can plant grasses, weeds, greens/lettuces, vegetable seeds (except those in the nightshade family) for them to eat the leaves, flowers, etc. You can do a forum search, or let us know if you need to be pointed int he direction of lists. Make sure anything they have access to has no pesticides/fertilizers. If you run out of graze for them, try separating the yard into two sections with cinder blocks or whatever is easiest, to give the grass time to recover. The earlier you expose them to the healthy foods, the better. If you will need to supplement the yard in the future, think about introducing them to low-protein hays. Mix in small quantities with what they already eat, and hopefully they'll get a taste for it. Make sure you don't have any problem getting them to eat the good stuff. Sometimes when you overdo the treat foods they will refuse the other stuff. They cannot digest the sugars, and it can lead to parasite blooms. Great advice here already.
Have they been checked out by a vet, for general health and parasites?
A general rule is that dry and a little cooler is ok, but not wet and cold. I would suggest to see if they like a warm dog house (you can use a ceramic heat emitter with a rheostat; also, at their larger size, it's ok to use a pig blanket). I have heard most torts will opt for a warm above ground area vs. burrowing once they get used to it. You wouldn't want to use a pig blanket for a small tort, but for them it's ok. You would need a shelter (dogloo even a smaller portable shed) so that they can get on and off the pads to thermoregulate). I'm sure the other members here can help you more with that setup if you are interested.
If you cannot see how far the burrow goes, you are in danger of (1) them escaping the yard, (2) getting stuck in a collapse because the soil may not be appropriate for burrowing, and (3) it getting too cold or flooded and they don't come out on their own. That story of how long that burrow was is a prime example! Just because they were "fine" last winter says nothing about the long term affects of being out in the weather in the burrows. Torts generally don't show any symptoms until they are very ill, and sometimes it is too late. Them being wet and cooler can lead to respiratory problems among other things.
Another issue you may need to think about it them reaching sexual maturity and the male being aggressive towards the female with mating rituals. It's rare to be able to house a male and female Sulcata (even two same-sex Sulcatas) in the same enclosure. A good start is knowing their sexes. If you post both tail and underside (plasteron) pictures, you should get a sure answer. Something you want to start to think about, as you may need two enclosures if the male starts to torment the female.
Don't mean to pry, but if you're babysitting, how long is that planned for? Can you provide us any pictures or description of their set up outside? Best wishes.
I agree to cut out the fruits. I would say no fruit except the occasional cactus treat. Squash is a once a week or less type of food, although good for them. They love the blooms if you can get those. There are lots of options for food it doesn't appear you are exploring, such as scattering seeds in the yard. You can plant grasses, weeds, greens/lettuces, vegetable seeds (except those in the nightshade family) for them to eat the leaves, flowers, etc. You can do a forum search, or let us know if you need to be pointed int he direction of lists. Make sure anything they have access to has no pesticides/fertilizers. If you run out of graze for them, try separating the yard into two sections with cinder blocks or whatever is easiest, to give the grass time to recover. The earlier you expose them to the healthy foods, the better. If you will need to supplement the yard in the future, think about introducing them to low-protein hays. Mix in small quantities with what they already eat, and hopefully they'll get a taste for it. Make sure you don't have any problem getting them to eat the good stuff. Sometimes when you overdo the treat foods they will refuse the other stuff. They cannot digest the sugars, and it can lead to parasite blooms. Great advice here already.
Have they been checked out by a vet, for general health and parasites?
A general rule is that dry and a little cooler is ok, but not wet and cold. I would suggest to see if they like a warm dog house (you can use a ceramic heat emitter with a rheostat; also, at their larger size, it's ok to use a pig blanket). I have heard most torts will opt for a warm above ground area vs. burrowing once they get used to it. You wouldn't want to use a pig blanket for a small tort, but for them it's ok. You would need a shelter (dogloo even a smaller portable shed) so that they can get on and off the pads to thermoregulate). I'm sure the other members here can help you more with that setup if you are interested.
If you cannot see how far the burrow goes, you are in danger of (1) them escaping the yard, (2) getting stuck in a collapse because the soil may not be appropriate for burrowing, and (3) it getting too cold or flooded and they don't come out on their own. That story of how long that burrow was is a prime example! Just because they were "fine" last winter says nothing about the long term affects of being out in the weather in the burrows. Torts generally don't show any symptoms until they are very ill, and sometimes it is too late. Them being wet and cooler can lead to respiratory problems among other things.
Another issue you may need to think about it them reaching sexual maturity and the male being aggressive towards the female with mating rituals. It's rare to be able to house a male and female Sulcata (even two same-sex Sulcatas) in the same enclosure. A good start is knowing their sexes. If you post both tail and underside (plasteron) pictures, you should get a sure answer. Something you want to start to think about, as you may need two enclosures if the male starts to torment the female.
Don't mean to pry, but if you're babysitting, how long is that planned for? Can you provide us any pictures or description of their set up outside? Best wishes.
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
