It has been suggested to me, and I must admit the logic behind it, that these are in no way wild ploughshare babies but really captive bred ones.
[split] Ploughshare discussion
- Thread starter Cowboy_Ken
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Ploughshare setup
How on earth do you have a ploughshare, they are critically endangered an illegal to own?
How on earth do you have a ploughshare, they are critically endangered an illegal to own?
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Ploughshare setup
China.
CourtneyG said:
China.
Ploughshare setup
Ahh because in china you can own anything illegal that is heading towards extinction.
Ahh because in china you can own anything illegal that is heading towards extinction.
Ploughshare setup
Think of the fine, competent breeders we all know and love here on the forum. Just think what they could do to further the ploughshare tortoises status if they weren't restricted by serious red tape and legalities. Just saying…
Think of the fine, competent breeders we all know and love here on the forum. Just think what they could do to further the ploughshare tortoises status if they weren't restricted by serious red tape and legalities. Just saying…
Ploughshare setup
Ploughshares that wind up in china are all stolen from the breeding compounds in Madagascar, which breeds them to be returned to the wild. Someone in china might be breeding them, but not to return to the wild, only to sell as pets to people in china.
Ploughshares that wind up in china are all stolen from the breeding compounds in Madagascar, which breeds them to be returned to the wild. Someone in china might be breeding them, but not to return to the wild, only to sell as pets to people in china.
Ploughshare setup
I don't think baby ploughshare tortoises are being smuggled out of Madagascar.
I don't think baby ploughshare tortoises are being smuggled out of Madagascar.
Ploughshare setup
Yes they actually are. People have been breaking into the compounds and stealing the hatchlings, easier to smuggle.
Yes they actually are. People have been breaking into the compounds and stealing the hatchlings, easier to smuggle.
RE: Ploughshare setup
Madagascar is an Island Nation with a mostly Tropic like condition and a small Semi-Arid area.
emystiong said:
Madagascar is an Island Nation with a mostly Tropic like condition and a small Semi-Arid area.
Ploughshare setup
Ploughshares are found in the semi arid area of Madagascar. They keep the area arid by eating the plants.
Ploughshares are found in the semi arid area of Madagascar. They keep the area arid by eating the plants.
RE: Ploughshare setup
The whole ideal on this species is just sad in general. That said. Introducing captive specimens would do way more harm than good of the wild population. There are many many issues to correct to stabilize the future wild populations. Its sad but in reality the more captive bred specimens the lower the percentage of wild demand/smuggling.
The whole ideal on this species is just sad in general. That said. Introducing captive specimens would do way more harm than good of the wild population. There are many many issues to correct to stabilize the future wild populations. Its sad but in reality the more captive bred specimens the lower the percentage of wild demand/smuggling.
Ploughshare setup
Yeah there needs to be captive breed to be sold to people, and to to put some into the wild to keep a wild species wild.
Such a hard thing to keep in balance and to make sure such a beautiful species go to the right people as well.
Yeah there needs to be captive breed to be sold to people, and to to put some into the wild to keep a wild species wild.
Such a hard thing to keep in balance and to make sure such a beautiful species go to the right people as well.
RE: Ploughshare setup
Agreed 100%. Maybe one day conservation breeding programs will take the Galapagos island repopulation techniques into consideration. Or even RSA namaqueland and arid geometric. We as people have to change to help the entire picture first.
CourtneyG said:
Agreed 100%. Maybe one day conservation breeding programs will take the Galapagos island repopulation techniques into consideration. Or even RSA namaqueland and arid geometric. We as people have to change to help the entire picture first.
RE: Ploughshare setup
The Project Angonoka is the only ploughshare breeding program in their native habitat. In May 1996, 75 tortoises were stolen. The security has increased and there have been no more thefts. The smuggled ploughshares are all from the Baly Bay region in western Madagascar.
CourtneyG said:
The Project Angonoka is the only ploughshare breeding program in their native habitat. In May 1996, 75 tortoises were stolen. The security has increased and there have been no more thefts. The smuggled ploughshares are all from the Baly Bay region in western Madagascar.
RE: Ploughshare setup
Many are still seen for sale on the Internet, in Asia, and at wildlife markets like Jakarta with minimal prosecution, if any.
Many are still seen for sale on the Internet, in Asia, and at wildlife markets like Jakarta with minimal prosecution, if any.
I split these posts off from the original thread because the OP of that thread was only asking for help with how he can make his habitat better for his tortoise.
If you all continue this discussion, please remember to be civil and don't argue. Also one of our rules is refrain from the discussion of illegal activity, so while we know that it is illegal to take the ploughshare from the wild, we should not discuss how we would do it, etc.
If you all continue this discussion, please remember to be civil and don't argue. Also one of our rules is refrain from the discussion of illegal activity, so while we know that it is illegal to take the ploughshare from the wild, we should not discuss how we would do it, etc.
RE: Ploughshare setup
They are endangered, but they are not illegal to own. Certain elements of our society would certainly like you to think they are though.
Tony already caught this one. This is not a regular occurrence. It only happened once. I think if you tried it today, you'd be shot.
All the babies we see in private hands today are the results of successful captive breeding, whatever the source of the adults.
CourtneyG said:
They are endangered, but they are not illegal to own. Certain elements of our society would certainly like you to think they are though.
CourtneyG said:
Tony already caught this one. This is not a regular occurrence. It only happened once. I think if you tried it today, you'd be shot.
All the babies we see in private hands today are the results of successful captive breeding, whatever the source of the adults.
RE: Ploughshare setup
I really don't think that's the case. At least here in my country I can say no more ploughshare/radiata smuggling over here...
The airport is heavily guarded and checked now. At least I can be pretty sure that no more new ploughshares coming here. Sometimes I see one or two ploughshares under advertisement for sell here, but all of them are old stocks which can be easily seen from their size and appearance (many are pyramiding)...
I can only say that some of the breeders here might be really close to breeding this species and actually with additional adults, that will 100% happen here like what Emystiong already did in Malaysia.
Anthony P said:
I really don't think that's the case. At least here in my country I can say no more ploughshare/radiata smuggling over here...
The airport is heavily guarded and checked now. At least I can be pretty sure that no more new ploughshares coming here. Sometimes I see one or two ploughshares under advertisement for sell here, but all of them are old stocks which can be easily seen from their size and appearance (many are pyramiding)...
I can only say that some of the breeders here might be really close to breeding this species and actually with additional adults, that will 100% happen here like what Emystiong already did in Malaysia.
Still being smuggled.
tortoises101 said:
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