[split] Does PetsMart sell wild caught or captive bred tortoises?

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CourtneyAndCarl

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tyrs4u said:
at the store back in Southern Cali; they were all WC. Only our mammal department actually had "companies" that drove in from Los Angeles weekly to supply the store every Thursday night. According to a friend that still works there Nothing has changed; except that they fired the manager there that told employee's to 'euthanize' rodents (that were sick or dieing/attacked) by placing them in the Freezer or feeding them to the (non-popular) snakes... The store made me sick; hence why I do not work for them. But simple answer, Torts 4 inches plus are *always in my opinion* WildCaught. The only way I have ever purchased a CB in a pet store (family owned and very christian; yikes); was by talking to the person that ran it and said "oh yeah we can get you those, we just have to contact our guy to see if he has any" basically a breeder in Portland...

RT in Oregon go for $99 & that's usually 5inch females WC... (the stores in my area)

At Petco, and I believe at Petsmart, too, if it doesn't say "captive bred" on the tag that means we don't know and that odds are it was probably wild caught. That's mostly with saltwater fish, but I think we have it on our herps too.
 

poison

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futureleopardtortoise said:
tyrs4u said:
at the store back in Southern Cali; they were all WC. Only our mammal department actually had "companies" that drove in from Los Angeles weekly to supply the store every Thursday night. According to a friend that still works there Nothing has changed; except that they fired the manager there that told employee's to 'euthanize' rodents (that were sick or dieing/attacked) by placing them in the Freezer or feeding them to the (non-popular) snakes... The store made me sick; hence why I do not work for them. But simple answer, Torts 4 inches plus are *always in my opinion* WildCaught. The only way I have ever purchased a CB in a pet store (family owned and very christian; yikes); was by talking to the person that ran it and said "oh yeah we can get you those, we just have to contact our guy to see if he has any" basically a breeder in Portland...

RT in Oregon go for $99 & that's usually 5inch females WC... (the stores in my area)

At Petco, and I believe at Petsmart, too, if it doesn't say "captive bred" on the tag that means we don't know and that odds are it was probably wild caught. That's mostly with saltwater fish, but I think we have it on our herps too.

or that can just mean that they dont know where they originally came from
 

CourtneyAndCarl

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poison said:
futureleopardtortoise said:
tyrs4u said:
at the store back in Southern Cali; they were all WC. Only our mammal department actually had "companies" that drove in from Los Angeles weekly to supply the store every Thursday night. According to a friend that still works there Nothing has changed; except that they fired the manager there that told employee's to 'euthanize' rodents (that were sick or dieing/attacked) by placing them in the Freezer or feeding them to the (non-popular) snakes... The store made me sick; hence why I do not work for them. But simple answer, Torts 4 inches plus are *always in my opinion* WildCaught. The only way I have ever purchased a CB in a pet store (family owned and very christian; yikes); was by talking to the person that ran it and said "oh yeah we can get you those, we just have to contact our guy to see if he has any" basically a breeder in Portland...

RT in Oregon go for $99 & that's usually 5inch females WC... (the stores in my area)

At Petco, and I believe at Petsmart, too, if it doesn't say "captive bred" on the tag that means we don't know and that odds are it was probably wild caught. That's mostly with saltwater fish, but I think we have it on our herps too.

or that can just mean that they dont know where they originally came from

With saltwater fish, it means they are wild caught. I'm not sure about the herps but I'm relatively sure that most of the lizards and snakes are cb but the torts are definitely WC
 

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futureleopardtortoise said:
poison said:
or that can just mean that they dont know where they originally came from

With saltwater fish, it means they are wild caught. I'm not sure about the herps but I'm relatively sure that most of the lizards and snakes are cb but the torts are definitely WC

The only saltwater fish that I know of that are captive-bred are some of the clownfish species, and maybe a handful of damselfishes...but they still offer WC specimens of those species as well; just because its a clownfish, doesn't mean its CB.

Anything else is definitely WC.
---------------
As far as herps go, any of the little cheap "yard" lizards and amphibians, like anoles, long-tailed lizards, croc geckos, house geckos, golden geckos, tokay geckos....pretty much anything $30.00 or less is almost definitely wildcaught. No one breeds anoles in captivity in enough numbers to meet the demands of pet stores. Even the water dragons or agamas are WC as well. Those are the African and Asian equivalents of our anoles and skinks and fence lizards. Just small little insectivores that 3rd world countries go out and collect by the hundreds for mere dollars a day to satisfy bazaars, food demands, and the pet trade. Thousands die in transit before they even reach the U.S. But still these are the small potatoes to importers and dealers.

Not trying to make anyone cry...just describing the reality of how some of those species end up in those tiny, cramped glass boxes in pet shop shelves.
 

Deac77

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As far as our supplier tells us they are cb as for the anoles and smaller lizards I literally give away at least 10 a week bc they hatch out in our facility and we can't sell them and that's just with the adults they send us breeding at my store in Texas we removed all our wc signs as soon as our suppliers stop supplying them also any new herp that is brought into the store is taken to the vet the same day and has a fecal and regular check up done before putting with the other herps no one has ever came back positive for parasites in the 3 years I've been manager there
 

StudentoftheReptile

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Deac77 said:
As far as our supplier tells us they are cb as for the anoles and smaller lizards I literally give away at least 10 a week bc they hatch out in our facility and we can't sell them and that's just with the adults they send us breeding at my store in Texas we removed all our wc signs as soon as our suppliers stop supplying them also any new herp that is brought into the store is taken to the vet the same day and has a fecal and regular check up done before putting with the other herps no one has ever came back positive for parasites in the 3 years I've been manager there

This is sadly the rare exception to the rule, on both accounts:
- Nearly all cases of captive breeding with anoles or other species I mentioned earlier are either accidental or mostly by enthusiasts devoted to that species. I only know of maybe 10-20 people nationwide (personally) who can take care of a single adult anole properly, much less get them to breed. Kudos on your success.
- Very pet stores have a vet check new arrivals or do fecal exams. In fact, very pet store critters ever see a vet at all while they are there, and those are usually the larger/pricier species such as parrots, or larger herps. No pet store I have ever encountered ever took a gecko or an iguana or a corn snake to the vet, much less an anole. There may be some general medications on hand for common ailments, but because the staff is so clueless, there is almost as much damage done with these as any illnesses themselves.
 

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Well, just for my own satisfaction, I called the two Petsmart stores in San Diego. Not that they wouldn't lie, but both store said that their tortoises are CB from a breeder and yes they know who the breeder is. I guess you need to decide if they are telling the truth or not. I would guess in Cali, probably the truth. If they were in oh say, indiana, Illinois or any of the colder states where I don't think there is as much breeding going on, well then I would say WC.

One more thing. Neither store breeds them in the store and neither store has a incubator with eggs in it.
 

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wellington said:
One more thing. Neither store breeds them in the store and neither store has a incubator with eggs in it.

Yeah, I used to work for Petsmart, too. Any breeding of any species is purely accident.
 

Deac77

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You don't have to believe me but I am tell you I've sent employees to the vet with corn snakes geckos and anoles and for the record I keep and breed anoles very successfully to feed certain snakes I keep like my vine snake it's Petsmart policy not to administer Meds without the animal seeing a doctor first not all petsmarts are as bad as you believe some have people like me who truly care about our animals and who are actually attending school to work with reptiles me for example I am going to school for herpetology with a emphasis in monitors and tegus particularly their intelligence
 

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Deac77, I do believe you. I am only stating that you are the exception, the minority....not the norm. My opinion is not flippant. It is been talking with many people over the past decade across the country working in various pet store environments, both the big box chains (Petsmart, Petco, etc) and the "mom and pop" shops that are privately-owned. There are a few good stores out there, and like you, there are certainly a handful of good, knowledgeable people employed by some. But again, this makes up the minority. The bottom line is that pet stores are businesses, and businesses exist to make money; when there are live animals involved, that regrettably doesn't change things much; just a few more policies to adhere to.
 

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Lol...I have to say, I am enjoying this thread. The first thing that popped to mind was, I wonder if this is the type of banter that occurred when we first began to understand torts need drinking water and other food besides iceberg lettuce.....lol...good stuff....
 

Deac77

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Lol I agree I take no offense I can only speak for what I do in my store
 

StudentoftheReptile

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PETsMART is a company that generally caters to "beginner pets." This is why they do not sell green iguanas or savannah monitors, or baby sulcata tortoises. However, just because its "small" doesn't make it a great starter reptile. It is my personal opinion that green anoles should not be sold in box chains. There is only one reason they are there: they are CHEAP. They are for the family who isn't quite ready to blow $40-60 on a leopard gecko or bearded dragon for their 10-yr old, much less the entire set-up ($100+). Let's just get him the $7 green lizard to shut him up before we think we're ready for this kind of pet. Nevermind the company-approved brochure that details the "proper" husbandry of anoles. Nevermind that this isn't a kid's pet; its a hands-off lizard; look but don't touch. They might spend a total of $30 on the thing, and within a month, it dies or they let the thing go. Same goes for long-tailed lizards. Those aren't kids pets.

Its great that there are hobbyists that enjoy those species, but IMHO, anoles are just one of those species that are not good in pet stores. Maybe in a specialty shop that is mostly reptiles operated by reptile people, but not these big box stores. \

There's only a niche market/community for anoles and most of that community knows what they're doing, and do not have to rely on pet shops for breeding stock, supplies, etc.

ascott said:
Lol...I have to say, I am enjoying this thread. The first thing that popped to mind was, I wonder if this is the type of banter that occurred when we first began to understand torts need drinking water and other food besides iceberg lettuce.....lol...good stuff....

I'm pretty sure it was, but apparently, it still goes on!

Remember that when I first got my sulcata, I did the same thing, and that was only a year ago. I mean, I'm not proud of it or anything, but that's just the information ingrained into me at the time.
 

Deac77

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I agree on anoles I only keep them myself as feeders they are like fish pretty and fun to watch when feeding but don't mess with them
 

CourtneyAndCarl

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Petsmart and Petco can only sell animals that aren't illegal in that area. So, I bet there is a Petsmart or Petco somewhere that sells green iguanas, just can't in most places because they are illegal.

I also take a little offense to the anole thing. We caught our own anoles in Florida and had them for several years, even got a few accidental babies. Sure we had no idea what we were doing, but we actually ended up taking pretty good care of them. :D
 

Deac77

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As far as I can tell company wide we do not carry green iguanas I personally have 2 though lol
 

CourtneyAndCarl

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Deac77 said:
As far as I can tell company wide we do not carry green iguanas I personally have 2 though lol

SOME petcos sell iguanas, but I assume it's probably more of if it's legal in that area, the store will special order it for you.
 

wellington

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Deac77 said:
You don't have to believe me but I am tell you I've sent employees to the vet with corn snakes geckos and anoles and for the record I keep and breed anoles very successfully to feed certain snakes I keep like my vine snake it's Petsmart policy not to administer Meds without the animal seeing a doctor first not all petsmarts are as bad as you believe some have people like me who truly care about our animals and who are actually attending school to work with reptiles me for example I am going to school for herpetology with a emphasis in monitors and tegus particularly their intelligence

It's not that we don't believe you. It's the stores and the way they can twist or hide things to make it sound better to make a buck. Your Petsmart and in your area and even Cali as I found out probably does have CB. The majority probably doesn't.
 
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