Soft Shell! anyone in NC RTP area? Need Vet recommendations

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firework

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My greek got soft shell. I got him less than 2 weeks ago. I didn't notice but I think his shell was good then.

I used a compact fluorescent UV lamp. Ater a couple days I found out he had difficulty opening one of his eyes and that eye might be (I think) a bit swollen. So I returned the compact bulb and ordered a MVB online.

T-Rex was often on back order at many websites, it seemed Petsmart was the only one I could find having T-Rex active in stock. Plus, there is a petsmart nearby, if this MVB goes wrong, I can always return it to the store. So I placed order at Petsmart, but it also takes 5 bussiness days to deliver. It will arrive on Monday.

This is my first tort. I thought MBD would take a while to develop (like most chronical disorders), a few days without UVB would not be a big deal as long as I feed him calsium suppliments and a varity of food. So I let the 4 month old goes withou UVB for about 5 days. Turned out, his shell softened quickly during the past 5 days. I didn't realize it's happening until yesterday morning, when I noticed his plastron was soft and thin and dull with a few wrinkles in the middle part. The top of the carapace is also a bit soft. So I put him outside for half an hour but I couldn't do it for long because I had to go work and the outside area wasn't prepared, there are squirrals all over the place. Yesterday evening first thing after work, I ran into Petsmart and brought him a fluorescent tube as a temporatory solution before the MVB arrives. I kept the lamp on over the night.

Now I am thinking I probably should take him to the vet. Giving him a calsium injection maybe a quick fix. Anyone recommends good herp vet in the NC RTP area?

I still can't believe the shell softens so fast. Could it be something else other than calsium deficiency?

He is not very active, but hard to tell if that's related to the shell problem. He eats normal, drinks occationally, peed and pooped quite okay. But he hides in his shell the rest of the day unless I wake him up.
 

tortoisenerd

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Don't keep a UVB or any light on overnight. Yes, find an experienced tort vet ASAP. The combo that you didn't give UVB (any amount of calcium without UVB won't help the tort's shell hardness as they need to produce the D3 from it) and maybe he had some of this going on before you got him is my guess because its a tad quick to happen, but not out of the question. Hopefully someone else pops on here soon to give you some advice too. Is he eating and basking? Temperatures? Diet? At that age his shell should feel a bit soft underneath (plasteron), but it should never become more soft, only more hard.
 

hpfirework

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Thanks for your reply. He doesn't bask. He eats when I wake him up and as soon as finishes eating, he buries himself in the substrate and spend the rest of the day just sleeping until I wake him up again for dinner. I don't know if this is his personality or his young age or stress of re-homing or illness.
 

Tom

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This didn't happen in two weeks. Its a long term problem. My tortoises have gone over a month, indoors under a regular incandescent bulb with no shell softening whatsoever.

Flourescent tubes do nothing but light up the enclosure. I don't care what the manufacturers light meter says. Reptiles develop MBD under them regularly. Compact flourescents don't do anything for UV either AND burn their eyes, as you've seen. An MVB is your best bet, if you must leave them indoors most of the time.

What your tortoise needs is lots of Ca supplementation and as much sunshine as you can give him. Even when they are outside in the shade, they are still absorbing UV rays. Build a large, safe, outdoor enclosure, put it in a safe place in the yard and get him out there as much as possible.

TORTOISES NEED SUNSHINE! (You forest tortoise people keep quiet. Even they need to be outside.)
 

firework

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Thank you very much. This tortoise was mail-ordered from a breeder. He is my first tortoise. I am right now feeling so inadequate and incapable. I called a couple of vets this morning. The earliest they can see my tortoise is on Tuesday. So I will go on Tuesday.

When he arrived two weeks ago, I notice the edge of the carapace was chipped. A transparent layer curved up. Some people on yahoo told me that's because his young age. I don't know if that's true. At that time I was worried about his sneezing problem. He doesn't sneeze now after some oral dose of Doxycycline.

Oh,, hold on. Could it be the Doxycycline? These tetracyclines are known to resorb bones as they bind strongly to calsium??

OMG. I think I know the reason. But if that's true, why he prescribed Doxycycline without telling me the serious side effects? I think Doxycycline is quite commonly used in treating respiratory problems in reptiles. Did I over dose him? I don't know now.

I will hate myself to death if I kill him. I will take him to the vet on Tuesday. Meanwhile, I will move his tub to the yard and feed him lots of calsium.

Thank you guys. Please pray that he can make it till Tuesday. He doesn't even have a name yet.

Tom said:
This didn't happen in two weeks. Its a long term problem. My tortoises have gone over a month, indoors under a regular incandescent bulb with no shell softening whatsoever.

Flourescent tubes do nothing but light up the enclosure. I don't care what the manufacturers light meter says. Reptiles develop MBD under them regularly. Compact flourescents don't do anything for UV either AND burn their eyes, as you've seen. An MVB is your best bet, if you must leave them indoors most of the time.

What your tortoise needs is lots of Ca supplementation and as much sunshine as you can give him. Even when they are outside in the shade, they are still absorbing UV rays. Build a large, safe, outdoor enclosure, put it in a safe place in the yard and get him out there as much as possible.

TORTOISES NEED SUNSHINE! (You forest tortoise people keep quiet. Even they need to be outside.)
 

Kristina

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Tom said:
TORTOISES NEED SUNSHINE! (You forest tortoise people keep quiet. Even they need to be outside.)

I will not be quiet, lol, whatever makes you think I would? ;)

I actually concur 100%. Even the indirect UV that a tortoise kept in outdoor shady conditions receives (from the light filtering through or bouncing off objects) is highly superior to any form of artificial UV lighting.

Tortoises NEED outside time. Even if it is 20 minutes two or three days a week.
 

tortoisenerd

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Make sure the temperatures are good and the enclosure is secure (fence dug in and wire over the top & sides if you aren't in line of sight). Provide a hide and if he'll be out there more than an hour, some water too. Did you see a vet to get the Doxycycline or give it yourself? Good luck!
 

fel1958

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last year i purchased 2 tortoises to add to the colony.they were hatchlings.they looked fine.about 3 months later,soft shells.all my other tortoises are perfect.i do think it was the breeders stock that has the issues and is getting passed on to other buyers.we use tnt and calcium and it seems to work fine.anyway the tortoises died and i didnt make a large issue out of it.we all know how that goes.its never anybodys fault.i purchased them from wanda on kingsnake.a lesson well learned.
 

firework

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I hope my baby is not genetically defected.

The mystery is, I really do not remember his platron was like that when he arrived.

I also do not understand why he doesn't like basking? If I put the thermometer directly under the lamp on the substrate, the temperature is 110F, is that too hot? But he also makes a sound when breath and his breath rate is fast, faster than mine.

fel1958 said:
last year i purchased 2 tortoises to add to the colony.they were hatchlings.they looked fine.about 3 months later,soft shells.all my other tortoises are perfect.i do think it was the breeders stock that has the issues and is getting passed on to other buyers.we use tnt and calcium and it seems to work fine.anyway the tortoises died and i didnt make a large issue out of it.we all know how that goes.its never anybodys fault.i purchased them from wanda on kingsnake.a lesson well learned.
 

Laura

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Hatchlings can be very fragile, as you are finding out.. not always a great thing for a beginner to deal with.
You are trying all you can.. he is still eating. so that is good. Get as much calcium rich food as you can into him. Cactus etc..
and SUNSHINE>
keep us posted...
 

hpfirework

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Came back from Vet's office. She said it is normal that 4 month old tortoise is not as firm as adults.

She said the noise he made when breathing is not sneezing, it is only the sound of head movement. She also said his breath rate is fast so she prescribed 14 day's doxycycline for that.

She recommended fecal check, which I will do after the doxycycline regimen.
 
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