small pieces

[Maggie Cummings]

I have had several discussions with forum members about cutting leafy greens up smaller for smaller mouths or leave the pieces in their natural larger state. I know that the discussions are old now, but I just came across these pictures when I was looking for Sulcata face pictures. It's my opinion and experience that it's better for babies to cut the greens up smaller and here are pictures showing exactly why. Most of you know I used to 'head start' Gopherus agassizii babies for my sister when I lived in California. One day as I was walking past this little guy's habitat I noticed he was using both feet to pull at his mouth, he had foamy bubbles surrounding his mouth and long strings of drool. It was obvious he was choking. I saw a piece of green sticking out one side of his mouth, so I used my fingernails to get a hold of the green and I slowly and carefully pulled this weed out. Some greens have a tough line that runs up the middle. This was a dandelion, you all have seen them and you know about the middle part, I don't know what it's called. But this is a good example of why I cut the greens up for smaller tortoises. When they are grazing they pull the weed against the ground and with the resistance of the ground the weed breaks off. Basically they don't bite it off, they break it from the ground. When they are eating inside they don't have the resistance of the ground. Yes, they hold it with their feet but sometimes that's just not good enough. Anyhow, here is this baby who was choking on this dandelion leaf, because he couldn't bite it off or have the resistance of the ground to break it off...

 

[ChiKat]

Very interesting Maggie, thanks for sharing. I have never cut up Nelson's greens but I might have to start doing that- or at least plants with the tough line down the middle.

 

[tjm1302]

i had a similar thing. I have Sapphire right beside me while I am at the computer and i noticed a few days ago while she was eating that she seemed to be struggling. I reaching in to help her break a piece off and pulled it out of her mouth... it was about 5 cm long. Almost the same length as her. So now i cut everything up!!!

 

[Stephanie Logan]

Hah! You don't have to persuade me to chop the food up small...it's the only way I can get Taco to eat a decent amount!

But isn't there an opposing view that having to bite and pull and push the food themselves helps to keep their beak trim?

 

[sammi]

Hah! You don't have to persuade me to chop the food up small...it's the only way I can get Taco to eat a decent amount!

But isn't there an opposing view that having to bite and pull and push the food themselves helps to keep their beak trim?

Yes I remember hearing that too Stephanie.. but I think more so if you just watch the plants that have long, thick stems, and shorten those a bit, you should be safe.

 

[Maggie Cummings]

Stephanie, I think that view is valid only if we are talking about being outside and grazing. Then they pull the weed and there is resistance with the ground. When there's no resistance there is no having to bite and pull and push. They can use their feet to hold the piece but there really is not enough resistance then in my humble opinion...
Haven't you had her long enough now that she should be over her rough treatment and she's eating normally now? Why does she have to have small pieces? Isn't she an adult? What is the problem now? I don't mean to be nosy, but I am curious...is that the same as nosy??? Hahaha

 

[Madkins007]

I would say that at about a year there is more benefit from whole foods than there is a risk from problems like Maggie discusses- but that younger animals often need some help with some foods.

Good observation, Maggie!

 

[Maggie Cummings]

I would say that at about a year there is more benefit from whole foods than there is a risk from problems like Maggie discusses- but that younger animals often need some help with some foods.

Good observation, Maggie!

More benefit Mark? How? Explain yourself

 

[motero]

Watch out for long blades of grass also. To tough for the little guys to bite in to pieces.

 

[tortoisenerd]

I have the opposing view, but with some stipulations that include only having the food whole if the tort can handle it (my guy can hold his food and tear off chunks with ease after some practice and working up to it), and I don't put stuff in whole with the veins that are a hazard...I will tear around the dandelion and turnip veins for example so it is still a huge piece, but only the leafy part not the middle with the stem (he won't eat the stems anyways). I mostly feed lettuces so frankly don't run into the veins as much. I do think that having torts that are able work at their food is more natural. My tort does tend to rub his beak across the slate when eating so that must help wear it down. I agree in everyone having all the information and making their own decision, so thank you Maggie for sharing. Glad the little one is ok! I think chopping up food for torts up to a year is a great compromise for both sides.

---

The benefits of whole foods in my opinion could include slowing down the tort's eating, having them build up the skills to use their beak and arms together to hold&rip the food, wearing down the beak/claws while eating, and feeding in a more natural way than mixing them a chopped salad.

 

[Stephanie Logan]

Haven't you had her long enough now that she should be over her rough treatment and she's eating normally now? Why does she have to have small pieces? Isn't she an adult? What is the problem now? I don't mean to be nosy, but I am curious...is that the same as nosy??? Hahaha

Well, I read your comments and thought, "Darn tootin'! She should have regular tortoise fare now!" So I didn't cut up the spring mix that I put out for her yesterday...and she didn't touch it. Worse, she stood next to her pile of food and stared reproachfully at me before turning away to take her mid-day nap. What a little martyr!

 

[RascalDesertTort]

I have a little clip that suctions to the wall and put wjole leaves on that. Do you think this is ok? Rascal seems to eat fine that way. I hgave 2 kids 3 and under, 5 pets and a husband to feed in the mornings and just dont have time to chop up fresh food everyday lol

 

[tortoisenerd]

I think that is a great idea, RascalDesertTort! Very natural. I think owner observation is the best thing. We all here on the forum can say a lot, but what you observe about your tort is the most important. Best wishes.

 

[sammi]

I don't normally cut up Ernie's spring mix [unless its a GINORMOUS piece] but today I think I might consider trimming stems on the lettuce. I went to check on Ernie, and picked him up to say hello. I noticed a long stringy thing on his tail, and thought it was just leftovers stuck to his tail. Upon pulling on it, I realized it was INSIDE of him..so when I pulled slightly harder, and I guess it urged him to have a bowel movement, because he let loose after that. After everything came out, the stringy thing was a good 6 inches long! Yikes. Poor guy.

 

[Maggie Cummings]

I don't normally cut up Ernie's spring mix [unless its a GINORMOUS piece] but today I think I might consider trimming stems on the lettuce. I went to check on Ernie, and picked him up to say hello. I noticed a long stringy thing on his tail, and thought it was just leftovers stuck to his tail. Upon pulling on it, I realized it was INSIDE of him..so when I pulled slightly harder, and I guess it urged him to have a bowel movement, because he let loose after that. After everything came out, the stringy thing was a good 6 inches long! Yikes. Poor guy.

That's why I recommend cutting up the food...

 

[chadk]

It happens to my outdoor torts as well. Sometimes they grab a long peice of grass or weed and it doesn't get broken down well and you see it in the poo later... Just because the grass is anchored, they don't just start eating from the tip and ripping off bits until they reach the base. They grab, pull, and the plant either rips out at the base or somewhere else. I don't worry about it. But I be more careful with hatchlings.