Russian Tortoise Keeping in the humid south

stjensen92

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I am looking for some practical advice on keeping Russian tortoises outdoors in the southern U.S. I live in central Louisiana where the summers are hot and humid and the winters get cold (into the 20's) and very rainy.

How should I keep these 'dry' tortoises? Bring them inside during winter? Have a covered (or partially covered) outdoor enclosure? Will they acclimate to my climate over time? Any help or comments is greatly appreciated!
 

MichaelL

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I keep my russians outside from march to around november here in north central Florida with an overall similar climate to yours, and they do fine. I have a dry hide they can go in when it rains during the summer and in that it stays overall dry. I don't worry much about them getting wet though, because they always dry up within the next day or next few days and it has never caused a problem for me. I worry more when it is cold and they are wet. I feel like they do acclimate to a more humid climate, as they have done fine here in Florida the past few years, but that is just my opinion. Also, I would definitely just bring them in during the winter.
 

stjensen92

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I keep my russians outside from march to around november here in north central Florida with an overall similar climate to yours, and they do fine. I have a dry hide they can go in when it rains during the summer and in that it stays overall dry. I don't worry much about them getting wet though, because they always dry up within the next day or next few days and it has never caused a problem for me. I worry more when it is cold and they are wet. I feel like they do acclimate to a more humid climate, as they have done fine here in Florida the past few years, but that is just my opinion. Also, I would definitely just bring them in during the winter.

When you bring them in for winter, what size enclosure is it (and for how many torts)? Also....are the brought in to hibernate or do you keep them warn all winter?
 

Blackdog1714

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I have mine in a 5’ diameter round pool with cypress mulch. CHE’s keep heat at 83 and he lives basking during the day. I also have a UVB
 

MichaelL

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When you bring them in for winter, what size enclosure is it (and for how many torts)? Also....are the brought in to hibernate or do you keep them warn all winter?
This past year I brought two in to hibernate in the fridge and I do recommend hibernating your tortoise. I also recently purchased another one so during the winter the new one had to stay awake. I had been using a 2x4 tub from walmart for the few colder months. This isn't really recommended for even one tortoise but it isn't their main enclosure and I know it won't affect them negatively for a couple months after having 9 to 10 months outside in the sun and having lots of space. If you could get bigger for a tortoise that would be better. When I had to bring the tortoises from outside before hibernation I would keep them in separate 2x4 bins for a couple weeks of no feeding to clear their gut before hibernation.
 

RosemaryDW

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Our Russians have evolved in an extremely dry environment. While Russians are hardy, they aren’t going “acclimate” to a humid climate; their respiratory systems just aren’t built for it or getting past respiratory infections. They can do fine with warm and humid; not cold and wet. As others have said, bring them inside or fridge hibernate. Both work, it’s more about what you have space for and are comfortable with.
 

Markw84

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Our Russians have evolved in an extremely dry environment. While Russians are hardy, they aren’t going “acclimate” to a humid climate; their respiratory systems just aren’t built for it or getting past respiratory infections.

Can't quite agree with this and I believe is an example of misconception about tortoises.

When it is said they "evolved in a dry environment", what environment are you referring to? Tortoises have been around for over 100 million years. The species we see today at least a million years for most. In that time, the climate has changed dramatically several times. The Sahel of the Sulcata, for example, just 25,000 years ago was a lush, humid forest. The climate of earth has cycled every 25,000-30,000 years from wetter to drier times. In fact, our own species, homo sapiens, could never have made it out of Africa if it were not for these changes as the massive Sahara is an impenetrable obstacle for early man. It was the wetter times when forest filled most of the Sahara region, that man was able to migrate north successfully.

We are in fact in one of the driest times now. The history we see as humans is extremely short and not representative of the conditions that existed the bulk of the historical times. We are being EXTREMELY short sighted in looking at current conditions to judge how a tortoise is "designed" or evolved. In evolutionary terms, we are looking at a few recent minutes of the history of tortoises. The majority of the evolutionary time tortoises have been with the earth, the climate was much different and much wetter, with far more vegetation. It is our current times (the last 3,000 years or so) that is the anomaly. This is one of the driest times tortoises have had to deal with and many species are suffering and probably would have been even without the problems man has brought. Tortoises are survivors. They have evolved ways to suffer through the tough, dry times and wait it out until conditions change and their species can thrive.

It is like looking at the conditions in the Mojave desert on August 15, and concluding that is exactly the conditions desert tortoises are designed to live in. Not true. That is the conditions desert tortoise can survive by hiding until conditions change.
 

stjensen92

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From what I've seen....tortoises seem to be able to adapt to some pretty harsh conditions. I've seen some Kamp Kenan episodes where he talks about how 'arid species' such as Sulcatas and Leopards have adjusted to living in the wet, humid south Florida area (although he said Russians may not do well?????)

Here in central Louisiana we average about 60 inches of rainfall per year...with winter months typically being 'wetter' than those in late summer. I'm wondering if I had an outdoor enclosure raised slightly above the surrounding ground level and containing well draining sandy, loam soil...(along with a somewhat large shelter)...would this do for most (or all the year) providing I have plenty of shelters/bunkers to retreat into????
 

MichaelL

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From what I've seen....tortoises seem to be able to adapt to some pretty harsh conditions. I've seen some Kamp Kenan episodes where he talks about how 'arid species' such as Sulcatas and Leopards have adjusted to living in the wet, humid south Florida area (although he said Russians may not do well?????)

Here in central Louisiana we average about 60 inches of rainfall per year...with winter months typically being 'wetter' than those in late summer. I'm wondering if I had an outdoor enclosure raised slightly above the surrounding ground level and containing well draining sandy, loam soil...(along with a somewhat large shelter)...would this do for most (or all the year) providing I have plenty of shelters/bunkers to retreat into????
They would for sure do well in my opinion. Tortoises can adapt amazingly. Mine live in an uphill, well drained loamy/sandy enclosure with many shelters, probably what yours will be like. They would definitely do well during the warmer spring, summer, and fall months and might do fine during winter with the shelters you provide. I personally would never leave mine out during the winter though because 1) it doesn't get cold enough during the winter here, it would need to be a consistent 40-50 degrees in their shelter for most of the winter. It usually gets in the 60s during winter days here which is too warm. However, where you are is a bit more cold so it would work better. I guess if your shelters are dry and the winter temps don't get too warm it could stay outside all year. I would just have the fear of them getting wet and getting a RI or getting sick or something after venturing out of the shelter during a warmer wet winter day and then having the temp drop in to the 30s again at night. If you could, it would be way better/ safer to keep them awake or hibernate them indoors in a fridge. Spending the winter in those shelters could work but it is more risky.
 

RosemaryDW

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Can't quite agree with this and I believe is an example of misconception about tortoises.

When it is said they "evolved in a dry environment", what environment are you referring to? Tortoises have been around for over 100 million years. The species we see today at least a million years for most. In that time, the climate has changed dramatically several times. The Sahel of the Sulcata, for example, just 25,000 years ago was a lush, humid forest. The climate of earth has cycled every 25,000-30,000 years from wetter to drier times. In fact, our own species, homo sapiens, could never have made it out of Africa if it were not for these changes as the massive Sahara is an impenetrable obstacle for early man. It was the wetter times when forest filled most of the Sahara region, that man was able to migrate north successfully.
Mark’s posts are among the most informative here; I always learn from him.

That said, my tortoise isn’t going to be around in 25,000 years. She’s tough; she is designed to hide from predators; she can go a long, long time without drinking; she can carry a lot of parasites. But I wouldn’t knowingly expose her to any of these things and I wouldn’t leave her out in uncontrolled winter weather conditions. Russians haven’t yet adapted to the cold damp; that’s why they are more subject to respiratory infections than other species.
 

Leo the Leopard

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I rescued a male Russian last spring and kept him in an outdoor enclosure, (weather permitting), in Augusta, GA. He has shady areas and direct sun areas, as well as hides that kept him dry. I brought him in when the weather cooled, along with my Leopards. He lives in a climate controlled (with UVB) environment, 4’ x 8’, until the warm weather returns. Having said all that, he LOVES water. He’ll come out of his hide in the rain, will run to me when I have the hose on, and will soak himself in his water dish all the time. :) I think he’s doing just fine with the humidity.
 

Blackdog1714

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My Russian loves it outside even in Richmonds nasty summer, but I did provide him with only the bestest of hides. A Tigloo 6000 - it was destined for the trash heap before I got my russianIMG_1769 (5).jpeg
 

jso

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Can't quite agree with this and I believe is an example of misconception about tortoises.

When it is said they "evolved in a dry environment", what environment are you referring to? Tortoises have been around for over 100 million years. The species we see today at least a million years for most. In that time, the climate has changed dramatically several times. The Sahel of the Sulcata, for example, just 25,000 years ago was a lush, humid forest. The climate of earth has cycled every 25,000-30,000 years from wetter to drier times. In fact, our own species, homo sapiens, could never have made it out of Africa if it were not for these changes as the massive Sahara is an impenetrable obstacle for early man. It was the wetter times when forest filled most of the Sahara region, that man was able to migrate north successfully.

We are in fact in one of the driest times now. The history we see as humans is extremely short and not representative of the conditions that existed the bulk of the historical times. We are being EXTREMELY short sighted in looking at current conditions to judge how a tortoise is "designed" or evolved. In evolutionary terms, we are looking at a few recent minutes of the history of tortoises. The majority of the evolutionary time tortoises have been with the earth, the climate was much different and much wetter, with far more vegetation. It is our current times (the last 3,000 years or so) that is the anomaly. This is one of the driest times tortoises have had to deal with and many species are suffering and probably would have been even without the problems man has brought. Tortoises are survivors. They have evolved ways to suffer through the tough, dry times and wait it out until conditions change and their species can thrive.

It is like looking at the conditions in the Mojave desert on August 15, and concluding that is exactly the conditions desert tortoises are designed to live in. Not true. That is the conditions desert tortoise can survive by hiding until conditions change.
Interesting, but doesn't negate Rosemary's point. Currently "available" horsfield tortoises will either have been WC or have come from WC stock from relatively recent times. Certainly very recent in terms of the time frames you're quoting! ("the last 3,000 years")
An individual modern-day horsfield specimen isn't going to suddenly acclimate by being kept in alien and unnatural conditions. Evolutionary adaptation,from your own argument, takes longer than that.
For sure, as a species tortoises are obviously very adaptable. But individual specimens aren't. The standard for the keeper has to be "what would this tortoise experience in its natural setting (today), and how can I best replicate that (as near as possible)?"
 
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