Rescued an African Spurred Tortoise- please help

Clorenzo85

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Kudos to you for rescuing Donatello. He looks like he suffers from MBD. He may have difficulty walking. Use the daily soaks to encourage him to exercise. Make it deep enough that he has to move his legs.
what does MBD mean?? i've soaked him three times since he moved in. Today was the first time that I've seen him active and trying to get out of his soaking space.
 

Clorenzo85

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Hi, we picked up Donatello from his previous owner only a couple of days ago. His owner allowed us to keep his tank. Donatello was kept in his tank all his life, with the occasional (vary rare) unsupervised outings. When I first saw Donatello, he was walking against his small glass tank. I knew then that I needed to take him in and give him a better life. I have three dogs, so it took me a few months to finally take the plunge. I knew nothing about reptiles, but I was motivated to learn as seeing him in that condition depressed me. Our first night with him, we added a shoe box in his tank since I read that they like to go into their caves to cool down. The next day, we bought several things that we learned he needed. Of course, our goal was to create a safe space for him to roam around, while keeping our dogs in mind. The more I learn about these amazing animals, the more I realize that he has suffered a hole lot in his life time. Please help me improve his quality of life. Doing the best I can to read up on what his needs are. Thank you in advance for your advice!

Since he was kept in an empty glass tank for all of his life, with no lamps to regulate the temperature, or given proper nutrition, he suffers from pyramiding. He is only 2 lbs and I think his age is 12 or 13 years old. I've read that the basking temp should be at around 100 but I'm now unsure if this would be the case for a little guy like Donatello. I guess my question is, what is the proper basking temperature for a 2lb, possibly 12 year old sulcata tortoise?

First night with us: Below you'll see the tank that his previous owner gave us, with old lettuce and all. We added the shoe box just for him to have a place to chill through the night. View attachment 264053

Day 2: We improved his space somewhat. View attachment 264055



Day 3: This is what we created for him to be able to roam around. He occasionally walks around but very very little. I can't wait to see what he'll be like once he trusts his environment.
View attachment 264054

I am learning something new everyday. This is only temporary.

donatellos new space.jpg
 

Big Charlie

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what does MBD mean?? i've soaked him three times since he moved in. Today was the first time that I've seen him active and trying to get out of his soaking space.
Metabolic bone disease. Make sure he has access to UV light and calcium. Until it is warm enough outside for him, you should buy a UV light, but make sure it isn't a coiled fluorescent. You can provide a cuttlebone for calcium or use a very light dusting of calcium powder on his food a few times a week.
 

Ray--Opo

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Like Big Charlie said get a flouresnt tube type UVB 18" long or longer. I would say if one of those lights in your dome is UVB it is the coil type. Those are not sufficient and damages the torts eyes. Arcadia or Zoo med have them online. Zoo med has a 10.0 UVB strength light not sure if Arcadia does.
Read the thread about closed enclosures. Donatello needs the enclosure at 80% or better humidity all the time.
Hang in there I started where you are and still have tons to learn.
 

Clorenzo85

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Like Big Charlie said get a flouresnt tube type UVB 18" long or longer. I would say if one of those lights in your dome is UVB it is the coil type. Those are not sufficient and damages the torts eyes. Arcadia or Zoo med have them online. Zoo med has a 10.0 UVB strength light not sure if Arcadia does.
Read the thread about closed enclosures. Donatello needs the enclosure at 80% or better humidity all the time.
Hang in there I started where you are and still have tons to learn.


Thank you. I'm order the proper lighting for him. I just bought what the pet store told me would work for Donatello. Now that i know better, I'm going to return it.
 

Clorenzo85

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Wow! Thank you so much for all of this info. So much to learn! Right now I’m shopping around for a long UV light and cover. We went to a reptile store near Victory and Reseda and I wanted to cry from seeing how all of these animals are kept. I almost didn’t feel right asking questions there. But I did learn that we need a longer UV light to cover a larger portion of where we are keeping Donatello since that tank is only temporary.
Once I get home, I’ll re read everything that you wrote and ask more questions. It makes me so sad to know that Donatello is about 13 years old and only 2 lbs. we’re trying our best to give him a larger space inside and a safe space outside since we have coyotes on our compound.


Would this be too much?

https://www.pangeareptile.com/store/arcadia-12-uvb-t5-ho.html
 

Ray--Opo

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Thank you. I'm order the proper lighting for him. I just bought what the pet store told me would work for Donatello. Now that i know better, I'm going to return it.
I bought the same one. The guy sold me Opo a setup with a 10 gallon aquarium,rabbit pellet type substrate, water dish that was a flipping hazard and those same lights. I thought I was buying from someone who knew how to care for sulcata's . After all I was at a Repticon show.
 

Clorenzo85

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I bought the same one. The guy sold me Opo a setup with a 10 gallon aquarium,rabbit pellet type substrate, water dish that was a flipping hazard and those same lights. I thought I was buying from someone who knew how to care for sulcata's . After all I was at a Repticon show.

After going back to the same pet store to return certain things that I over paid for and didn't need, one of the employees admitted to me that he is required to sell certain products. He ended up telling me where I can get products for cheaper. He also didn't sound too knowledgeable about tortoises. He assumed that all reptiles are the same. Just annoys me because a lot of people who go there, are unsure and trust employees to be experts.
 

Clorenzo85

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Like Big Charlie said get a flouresnt tube type UVB 18" long or longer. I would say if one of those lights in your dome is UVB it is the coil type. Those are not sufficient and damages the torts eyes. Arcadia or Zoo med have them online. Zoo med has a 10.0 UVB strength light not sure if Arcadia does.
Read the thread about closed enclosures. Donatello needs the enclosure at 80% or better humidity all the time.
Hang in there I started where you are and still have tons to learn.

Should I take out his current UVB light? i ordered the Arcadia one 12%. It should be here in a week or so. Just wondering if I should just take out the coil UVB light and just wait for his new one to be delivered. I don't want to be the reason why his eyes are damaged.
 

Clorenzo85

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Oh my. You are doing an amazing thing taking in poor Donatello. I can't believe he was kept all his life in that glass enclosure [emoji45]

Basking temps should be between 95-100F with enough room for him to move in and out of the hot area as needed.

Thank you for helping little Donatello. I'm sure others will be along soon with more advice
 

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Clorenzo85

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Hello and welcome. I'm just north of you in SCV...

All of this applies:
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.79895/
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/for-those-who-have-a-young-sulcata.76744/

One primary concept to understand is that this tortoise comes from a tropical area and they need warm temps day and night, year round. Cold SoCal nights will make it sick. Room temp inside a house is not warm enough. Down on the floor is even colder. They need it no lower than 80-85 day and night. Once spring returns, you can Mae a proper outdoor enclosure, fenced from the dogs, and build a proper heated night house for this guy. Then, he can live outside full time. Here is an example: https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/another-night-box-thread.88966/#post-828952

This tortoise needs a basking area, but it needs to be about 95-100 at tortoise shell height. Put a brick on its side directly under the basking bulb and let it cook for an hour or two. Then get a digital thermometer from Lowes, Walmart or Home Depot and put it directly under the bulb on top of the brick. You want it to creep up to 95ish. If its too hot, use a lower wattage bulb, raise it up, or install a dimmer so you can dial it down a little.

Another thing to know is that pet stores have no idea how to properly care for tortoises and they will sell you the wrong stuff and give you bad advice. Most vets too. Along these lines, most of what you read on the internet and in books is wrong too. It took me, and many others, decades to figure this out. The old care advice is based on incorrect assumption of how they live in the wild, and some of it is based on other species with different temperature needs. Then you run in to people that will say: "I've done it this way for years and he's fine..." The people you got him from might say that. How bad could it be, right? He's still alive and look how much he's grown over the years...

Right now is our prime weed season. There is a ton of free food growing all around you. If you aren't sure what is good, or if its from a safe source, you can shoot across the 210/118 over to Sunland produce and get some cheap endive and escarole. I'll set you up with a bunch of free opuntia pads. Some for planting and some for eating, if you want. I can point out some weeds too. Look up mallow. Its a good one and its all over the place.

Please come back and ask all your questions. We like talking torts here.

This is what I have so far. I have to hang up the UVB light. I need to figure out the heating part. Since the heat lamp is all I have right now. I was checking out the heat pads that you have. I just want to make sure that mother is a fire hazard.
 

EllieMay

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It looks wonderful!!!! Your doing great! People raise there torts in many different ways . You have improved that tortoises quality of life SO much! As long as his heat is maintained, the “how” is your choice. . Is he more active now? I remember you being worried about MBD....
 

Tom

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Unless the whole room is 80 at the floor level, there is no way to keep temps correct with an open topped enclosure on the floor. You could run 3 CHEs all spread out, but all that electric heat will dry things out horribly, and the heat will all just keep rising up and into the room. Open topped enclosures only work if the room temp is the temp you are looking for.

I don't see anything in there for night heat or ambient temp maintenance during the day.

You need a flat rock of some sort under the basking lamp. This gives the tortoise somewhere warm to lay and also helps disperse the heat. You can measure surface temps that way too.

If your UV tube in one of the HO types, you'll burn his eyes having it that close. 18-20" over the shell should be about the right height for a 12% HO bulb.
 

Clorenzo85

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It looks wonderful!!!! Your doing great! People raise there torts in many different ways . You have improved that tortoises quality of life SO much! As long as his heat is maintained, the “how” is your choice. . Is he more active now? I remember you being worried about MBD....

He is way more active now. I just have to figure out the heating for his entire enclosure. And how to hang out UVB light.
 

Clorenzo85

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Unless the whole room is 80 at the floor level, there is no way to keep temps correct with an open topped enclosure on the floor. You could run 3 CHEs all spread out, but all that electric heat will dry things out horribly, and the heat will all just keep rising up and into the room. Open topped enclosures only work if the room temp is the temp you are looking for.

I don't see anything in there for night heat or ambient temp maintenance during the day.

You need a flat rock of some sort under the basking lamp. This gives the tortoise somewhere warm to lay and also helps disperse the heat. You can measure surface temps that way too.

If your UV tube in one of the HO types, you'll burn his eyes having it that close. 18-20" over the shell should be about the right height for a 12% HO bulb.

Bought a ceramic tile. Hope that’s fine. I also bought a temperature gun. I’ve been using the therm Pro for humidity and temp.
 

Clorenzo85

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Unless the whole room is 80 at the floor level, there is no way to keep temps correct with an open topped enclosure on the floor. You could run 3 CHEs all spread out, but all that electric heat will dry things out horribly, and the heat will all just keep rising up and into the room. Open topped enclosures only work if the room temp is the temp you are looking for.

I don't see anything in there for night heat or ambient temp maintenance during the day.

You need a flat rock of some sort under the basking lamp. This gives the tortoise somewhere warm to lay and also helps disperse the heat. You can measure surface temps that way too.

If your UV tube in one of the HO types, you'll burn his eyes having it that close. 18-20" over the shell should be about the right height for a 12% HO bulb.

Right now the room temperature is about 75 and his floor temperature ranges from 70 to 74%. I can get a small heater for this room. It's a small room. I don't know what else to do besides ordering the panel and kane heat mats.
 

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