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High yellow Pyxis Arachnoides
- Thread starter mitchellr
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Does this mean one of the articles mentions that arachnoides eats fruit in the wild? Can you tell me which so I can save the time of reading through most of them? I have read most of them, but wouldn't know if I missed something without reading everything. I know Pearson's article mentions fruit, but his research/paper is based on captivity, and most of the stuff on natural history topics involve a contact of mine whom originally opened my eyes to the lack of fruit in the wild diet.
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It means I was speculating on the otherwise non-disclosed source that states they do or do not eat fruit in the wild. There can be no 'they never eat fruit in the wild' as no one has observed all the individuals eating every meal, it only takes one eating some sort of fruit once to suggest they might/do eat fruit in the wild. Then there is the whole debate about what fruit is. In the botanical sense I don't see how they could not eat fruit, to much fruit out there.
You or Tim/Robin suggest there was some document, text, article suggesting the suitability of fruit in the diet, I just took a poke/guess as to what that document, text or article was.
I have P. planicauda and they eat lots of fruit, Squash is fruit, they eat lots of squash. They also get mulberries. Sometime cucumber and other not so sugary fruits. They like cactus fruit too.
So what was the document, text or article you'all were talking about in the earlier post. I'm no seeking to directly quote, the nature of pages on TFO is such that if I flip back one window the the earlier part of the thread, I'll loose this response. At least that's been my experience.
You or Tim/Robin suggest there was some document, text, article suggesting the suitability of fruit in the diet, I just took a poke/guess as to what that document, text or article was.
I have P. planicauda and they eat lots of fruit, Squash is fruit, they eat lots of squash. They also get mulberries. Sometime cucumber and other not so sugary fruits. They like cactus fruit too.
So what was the document, text or article you'all were talking about in the earlier post. I'm no seeking to directly quote, the nature of pages on TFO is such that if I flip back one window the the earlier part of the thread, I'll loose this response. At least that's been my experience.
Yeah, this all makes great sense to me. My source was Michael Ogle. He and I discussed the fact that fruit was not a part of the wild diet of arachnoides. Succulents, dried leaves, even insects living in piles of dung, but nothing like strawberries, for example. I realize the word "never" is a strong word, and Justin Beiber taught us to "Never Say Never."
I have yet to seen any research say that they eat fruit in the wild. This whole conversation started when I mentioned that fact when someone was trying to figure out what to feed them in captivity. I mentioned that I wonder why, after my conversations with Michael, that everyone just assumes that they should offer them fruit. Seems weird to me, personally, that we would do that for a species that does not consume it in the wild. We've seen what that can do to Testudo, for example, right?
So, Tim then asked me who said they don't eat fruit. There are a few places that talk about the diet of arachnoides, but none of them list fruit as a food item. I asked him to tell me which research/journal says that fruit IS consumed by this species in the wild, and I have yet to see any. I would love to see it, if it is there and I am not totally doubting that it exists, just saying I haven't seen it yet. There is only stuff that says that they eat it in captivity and that people "should" offer it.
I have yet to seen any research say that they eat fruit in the wild. This whole conversation started when I mentioned that fact when someone was trying to figure out what to feed them in captivity. I mentioned that I wonder why, after my conversations with Michael, that everyone just assumes that they should offer them fruit. Seems weird to me, personally, that we would do that for a species that does not consume it in the wild. We've seen what that can do to Testudo, for example, right?
So, Tim then asked me who said they don't eat fruit. There are a few places that talk about the diet of arachnoides, but none of them list fruit as a food item. I asked him to tell me which research/journal says that fruit IS consumed by this species in the wild, and I have yet to see any. I would love to see it, if it is there and I am not totally doubting that it exists, just saying I haven't seen it yet. There is only stuff that says that they eat it in captivity and that people "should" offer it.
I would seem to think that the primary large fruitier in the western dry forest from the baobab trees would be a highly consumed fruit by planicauda, arachnoides arachnoides and arachnoides brygooie as many nine species of baobab thrive in the western region and territory of those 3 Pyxis. Not certain about oblonga. But I'd speculate and believe that the heaviest fallen fruit of these trees occur right before the west season when hatchlings emerge in the wild from October-November. Obviously there's very little data on this theory of mine. But given the few species of vegetation in those regions and the main seed dispersal of the many species of baobabs are from lemurs, and other vegetarian (also tortoises) species. I read an article about that seed dispersal. May have some bearing on this.
http://www.planta.cn/forum/files_planta/j1365_2028200700755x_475.pdf
http://www.planta.cn/forum/files_planta/j1365_2028200700755x_475.pdf
If you'd also like to research more on the kirindy dry scrub forests and the flora here's a complete bibliography. May take some serious time but could possibly spearhead a great captive diet for Pyxis(but in question oblonga as there range is a bit different)
http://www.mikepalmer.co.uk/woodyplantecology/docs/MNR-Kirindy-biblio.pdf
http://www.mikepalmer.co.uk/woodyplantecology/docs/MNR-Kirindy-biblio.pdf
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Great contribution to the conversation @tortadise . FWIW I have Primate report 46, and a few other of the articles in the Kirindy forest bib. My Library is again in disarray since my move a year ago, so no quick way to find it.
And I see you are taking the botanical view on what fruit is. I agree that varieties bred for 'housewife/home' choosiness are too sugary for tortoises for the most part, which is what I think the 'no fruit' camp is likely talking about. This morning I fed some banana to the P.planicauda, one banana mixed in with about 10 pounds of chopped escarole/romaine/radicchio mix. Oddly it smells like bananas, but the actual proportion as a % is very very small. They pull up out of their winter time slumber and eat some, then go back to low activity, which for planicauda means rocks with moss, not just rock. Summer time they are pretty bouncy though. They remind me of some of the weird behaviors of G. spengleri. I guess they are all somewhat comical little beasts.
And I see you are taking the botanical view on what fruit is. I agree that varieties bred for 'housewife/home' choosiness are too sugary for tortoises for the most part, which is what I think the 'no fruit' camp is likely talking about. This morning I fed some banana to the P.planicauda, one banana mixed in with about 10 pounds of chopped escarole/romaine/radicchio mix. Oddly it smells like bananas, but the actual proportion as a % is very very small. They pull up out of their winter time slumber and eat some, then go back to low activity, which for planicauda means rocks with moss, not just rock. Summer time they are pretty bouncy though. They remind me of some of the weird behaviors of G. spengleri. I guess they are all somewhat comical little beasts.
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