hi, I'm new, I'm doing everything wrong and I need some advice! (Sulcatas)

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knighterson

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Hi everyone,
I have been a reptile enthusiast for most of my life, but recently bought my 1st tortoise- a baby sulcata- from LLL in Menifee, CA. I researched these guys for about 3 months, and thought I was ready to go. I bought books, read online, talked extensively to the staff at LLL, etc. But after finding this website through the iphone app earlier this week I realize I have really been doing things wrong. I've probably spent 3 hours or so searching through the threads and posts during the last few days, heres some background on our situation- I live in the Palm Springs CA area, very hot and dry. I initially set up the indooor enclosure the way LLL recommended and had their enclosure set up, which was dry. I used a pine shavings type of material with a powersun 100 Mercury Vapor at one end, about 12" above the substrate during the day, and I have now started using a 75 watt black bulb set directly on the screen, about 10" above the substrate at night, although up unitl last week I wasn't using heat at night, but from what I'm reading, changing to a more humid substrate requires some extra heat at night. I built the enclosure, its about 3.5 feet long, and 20" wide, 10" high. Basic wood sides, about 2/3 of the top is screened, and 1/3 is enclosed. The powersun is at the opposite end of the enclosed portion. I also have a partition inside with a smaller opening going into the enclosed part. Its basically like a large hide area. The problem is (and I'm sure you guessed already), my little guy/gal, named Pickles, has begun to show signs of bumpy/wrinkled looking shell, theres even a slight ridge starting right behind his head and going about 1/4" back on the shell. I've had him almost 2 months, and his shell has been slightly bumpy since we bought him. I blame myself for not being educated correctly, and not noticing what I now understand to be signs of dehydration. I have now changed his bedding out to the coconut fiber material, and mist to try to simulate the burrow that he would probably be in in the wild. We have a/c, and it does dry out the house, during the day it is set to 79*, at night this part of the house (we have 2 a/c's) is set to 85*. I can't seem to keep the humidity consistently above 20%. I figure I should cover most of the top, and buy a fogger, because misting doesn't seem to be doing the trick. It seems all of the info I received while researching told me hot and dry were the best, and thats the same thing the pet store told me. He's very active, gets 1-2 hours outside time a day, usually in the late afternoon. I am building an outdoor enclosure so that he can spend a little more time outside, although with it being so hot, I'm nervous about that. I'm thinking of adding misters to the outdoor enclosure, and I've already created a lot of shade through plants and hides. I know I can't change things that have alreay happened, but I want to do everything possible to ensure things are right from here on out. One more thing- I soak him every day for about 15-20 minutes. What else should I change? Any advice would be much appreciated. Thanks!
 

tortadise

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RE: hi, I'm new, I'm doing everything wrong and I need some advice!

Welcome! no reason to blame yourself. Research before aquiring was the right choice. Tom has a wonderful, article on beginner tortoise especially for sulcatas. Lots of info here for you to learn and get that little guy growing perfectly.
 

lisa127

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RE: hi, I'm new, I'm doing everything wrong and I need some advice!

Like you, I've kept herps for a very long time. Not most of my life, but for the past 20 years. Snakes and lizards of all kinds. Even after 20 years of experience, turtles and tortoises are the most challenging reptiles I have ever kept.

My guess is, as far as pancakes go and keep in mind I've never kept a pancake.......make a simple humid hide he can have access to and don't fret so much about the overall humidity. And put the humid hide on the warm side of the enclosure.
 

Tom

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RE: hi, I'm new, I'm doing everything wrong and I need some advice!

Hello and welcome. Don't worry about the past. None of us were born knowing this stuff. It sounds like you did all a person could do. This misinformation has been around a long time and it is taking a long time to overcome it too. It sounds like you are on the right track now. Instead of fighting the heat and humidity issue with tons of water, devices and electricity, just make a closed chamber. You'll use a tiny fraction of the electricity and conditions will always be good for your tortoise. There is a thread for this in my signature.

About LLL... That company is owned by a buddy of mine. I have know him for about 15 years, but I only ever see him at the reptile shows. He's a busy guy. He's also a good guy and is really just following the advice of the experts in the industry. These experts have been around a long time and are reluctant to accept new advice from people who are just starting out or who they perceive to have less experience than them. What's funny is they will all admit their repeated failures to me, while they are telling me why they don't think my system that works will work. I've even shown some of them the pics, and they don't have much to say... In time they will come around. I have managed to get through to a few of them.

I have been in touch with the brother of my friend who owns LLL, a manager of one of the stores, and several employees. They are open to the idea, investigating more, and willing to try out some new techniques. We'll see how things go in the next few months. From where I am sitting, they are a victim of the same misinformation as you, me and the rest of the industry. The stuff you were told is the same stuff that I was told 20 years ago. It was wrong then and its still wrong now. Times are a changin', but it won't happen overnight.

If your tortoise is not too damaged internally from his first few weeks of chronic dehydration, he should come around, grow normally, and be just fine. Only time will tell.
 

ALDABRAMAN

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RE: hi, I'm new, I'm doing everything wrong and I need some advice!

Welcome!
 

wellington

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RE: hi, I'm new, I'm doing everything wrong and I need some advice!

Hello and WELCOME:DDon't blame yourself. Your tort was already starting g to pyramid before you got him. All of LLLReptiles are, not sure why they don't change their caring methods. Stick with what you learn here and you will be on the right track soon. Good luck. The threads at the bottom of my post are Tom's. They are all great for sulcatas.
 

pam

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RE: hi, I'm new, I'm doing everything wrong and I need some advice!

Welcome :)
 

Yvonne G

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RE: hi, I'm new, I'm doing everything wrong and I need some advice!

Hi Knighterson:

Welcome to the Tortoise Forum!!

What would you like us to call you?
 

dmarcus

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RE: hi, I'm new, I'm doing everything wrong and I need some advice!

Hello and welcome..
 

kanalomele

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Welcome to TFO. Read and re-read some of the posts here. Amazing what I have learned after owning torts for 13 years.
 

knighterson

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Thanks everyone! You can call me Jay, I appreciate the feedback. I happened across another thread after I posted this entitled 'early pyramiding?' or something like that. The ridge on that little tort was similar to what I am seeing on our sulcata, and everyone seemed to think that was growth related, so hopefully that part at least is ok. He eats well, and is very active. I soak him everyday. When I first started soaking him when we brought him home he would drink for what seemed like several minutes, just stick his little head in there and go for it. After a couple weeks he stopped drinking so much and now doesn't drink much when soaked, although he has a walk in water dish in his enclosure (which gets changed daily). His head seems to get kind of dry/scaly also, but I'm really hoping there was no permanent damage done. I just built him an outdoor enclosure today complete with irrigation system for mornings and late afternoons when the temp isnt at its highest. It's not large- only about 6' x 2.5', but he's still tiny.

As far as LLL- please don't misunderstand me, it's a great reptile shop and I know they have a job to do, I just wish I would have found this forum first. You are all right- there's a ton of either mis or old info out there, but thanks for being part of this and sharing your insights, it's really invaluable to me. I'll keep you all updated, thanks again.
 

knighterson

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Also, I did read your article on raising young sulcatas Tom, thanks for the easy to read info!
 

Jacqui

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Hi and welcome! You didn't do everything wrong, so relax. Also with all information about tortoises you will learn you have to take the old (of which much is very good information), the new (which like the old has good and bad information) and then apply it to YOUR situation and YOUR tortoise. No one way is right or wrong, just shades of grey and sometimes even the same information just worded differently. :cool: :D. The main thing is, your asking questions, researching, learning and incorporating what you learn into your situation. That is what matters.
 
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