Heating elements for a night box in Fresno, CA

Joined
Dec 16, 2019
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35
Location (City and/or State)
Fresno
We are building a night box for our sulcata similar to the type that Tom and others have posted. I greatly appreciate the plans, instructions, and diagrams that have been posted. Ours will be about 4' wide, 8' long, and 2' tall (interior height). Every wall, roof, floor, and door is, or will be, insulated with 1.5" solid insulation. We have a cane mat an 80 watt RHP (from his current inside enclosure), and a 700 watt oil-filled radiator at hand. However, after reading the warnings on the radiator I am having second thoughts about it due to fire safety concerns. It would have to be plugged into an extension cord (via thermostat), and would obviously be much closer than 3 feet to an object. We want to use the safest effective hPXL_20201213_185507875.jpg
 
Joined
Dec 16, 2019
Messages
35
Location (City and/or State)
Fresno
We are building a night box for our sulcata similar to the type that Tom and others have posted. I greatly appreciate the plans, instructions, and diagrams that have been posted. Ours will be about 4' wide, 8' long, and 2' tall (interior height). Every wall, roof, floor, and door is, or will be, insulated with 1.5" solid insulation. We have a cane mat an 80 watt RHP (from his current inside enclosure), and a 700 watt oil-filled radiator at hand. However, after reading the warnings on the radiator I am having second thoughts about it due to fire safety concerns. It would have to be plugged into an extension cord (via thermostat), and would obviously be much closer than 3 feet to an object. We want to use the safest effective hView attachment 312946
It looks like my message was truncated but I am basically looking for suggestions on the safety and effectiveness of various heating options because I am second guessing the safety of the oil filled radiator.
 

G-stars

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I have smoke/ fire alarms in all my outdoor enclosures and a fire extinguisher on standby. I’m hoping that would give me some time to save the tortoises and put out the fire in case of such an event. I also replace my heating element, extension cords, and thermostats every 5-6 years. Call me paranoid but I’ve seen/ heard of one too many accidents. Better safe then sorry.
 

G-stars

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It’s also cheaper to replace all your electronics every 5 years then the alternative. Replace your enclosure (~400-800) depending what materials were used and how large it is, replace your tortoises (~100-thousands and thousands worth of tortoises) like some of us have, and of course the cost of replacing ones home if a fire were to break out and catch your own home on fire (priceless). Think about yourself and your loved ones.
 

Maro2Bear

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Generally, it’s always good practice to never use an extension cord with a heater. Most ppl use too light weight gauge of a cord and it heats up, causing a fire.

Hopefully you don’t have a long distance? The shorter the distance the better.

Shop for & use a heavy gauge extension cord - https://www.thespruce.com/select-proper-electrical-extension-cord-1824710

Ive used extension cords on our Sullys indoor Winter enclosure for years with no issue. Heater is one of those farmer style heaters. The oil type that you are looking are much safer, slowly heat up and maintain temps well when you also use a thermostat. Kane heat mat & radiator into the thermostat work well.
 
Joined
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Fresno
Thanks for the replies. To be clear, we are not trying to cut corners, we are looking for suggestions on the safest heating technologies that could be effective for the size of our box in our climate. We wouldn't skimp on an extension cord and will plan on putting an outlet near the box in the near future. Fire alarms are a good idea.
 

Maro2Bear

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Thanks for the replies. To be clear, we are not trying to cut corners, we are looking for suggestions on the safest heating technologies that could be effective for the size of our box in our climate. We wouldn't skimp on an extension cord and will plan on putting an outlet near the box in the near future. Fire alarms are a good idea.

Yep. I really don’t ever recall an instance here on the Forum where anyone has had a fire issue with the oil type heater. Safely secured inside, a few inches all around, and using a thermostat all help. Good luck.

Ps - if you want another option, you could install a Radiant Heat Panel into the roof. Many of Tom’s builds show the Kane Pig Blanket Mat on the floor & a RHP in the ceiling. Optional too is the oil heater as well.

I use this type - ➡ https://www.reptilebasics.com/rbi-radiant-heat-panels
 
Joined
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Location (City and/or State)
Fresno
Yep. I really don’t ever recall an instance here on the Forum where anyone has had a fire issue with the oil type heater. Safely secured inside, a few inches all around, and using a thermostat all help. Good luck.

Ps - if you want another option, you could install a Radiant Heat Panel into the roof. Many of Tom’s builds show the Kane Pig Blanket Mat on the floor & a RHP in the ceiling. Optional too is the oil heater as well.

I use this type - ➡ https://www.reptilebasics.com/rbi-radiant-heat-panels
Thanks. Those panels are on our radar screen. The only hesitation is if RHPs and a kane mat would provide sufficient heat. Normal wintertime lows here are usually in the high thirties, but it's not unheard of to get occasional lows in the high 20s.

Matt
 

Maro2Bear

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Thanks. Those panels are on our radar screen. The only hesitation is if RHPs and a kane mat would provide sufficient heat. Normal wintertime lows here are usually in the high thirties, but it's not unheard of to get occasional lows in the high 20s.

Matt

Right. Im sure you are on the right track. A super insulated nightbox, with a Kane heat mat on the floor & RHP in the ceiling work well. But, you have to decide that based on your build/insulation, etc. The RHPs are very nice, easy to install, variety of wattage sizes. Heck, you could do all three - mat, oil heater & RHP. Good luck.
 

Tom

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We are building a night box for our sulcata similar to the type that Tom and others have posted. I greatly appreciate the plans, instructions, and diagrams that have been posted. Ours will be about 4' wide, 8' long, and 2' tall (interior height). Every wall, roof, floor, and door is, or will be, insulated with 1.5" solid insulation. We have a cane mat an 80 watt RHP (from his current inside enclosure), and a 700 watt oil-filled radiator at hand. However, after reading the warnings on the radiator I am having second thoughts about it due to fire safety concerns. It would have to be plugged into an extension cord (via thermostat), and would obviously be much closer than 3 feet to an object. We want to use the safest effective hView attachment 312946
The reason I use the radiant oil heaters is because of their safety, reliability and effectiveness. I got the idea from a friend who was using one in a 3x3' cube box. No Insulation. Not sealed and he just had the heater sitting in the box loose on its own wheels. This was a full size radiant heater. He had it on high (1500 watts) and it was touching th side of the box, and only a few inches from the top of the box. No thermostat. It was just "on" all the time and he was using a 100 for 16 gauge extension cord draped around outside. His 100 pound tortoise could rest against it and move it.

I'm happy to report that he did this for years and never had a problem. If he can do all that, and rest the heater up against the wood, I'm not worried about a smaller, lower wattage heater, solidly mounted 6 inches from any wood and controlled by a thermostat attached to a 12 gauge cord.

I've been using them for about 10 years now in a dozen boxes around my ranch, and I've had no problems. Just recently I tried a couple of the flatter, 400 watt ones, and one of them appears to have stopped working recently after only a few years. Had to replace it. The regular style mini oil heaters last forever apparently.

I use the oil heaters in all my 4x8' boxes. Sometimes I also add a Kane mat, a RHP, or an overhead basking lamp, depending on the species and situation, in addition to the oil heater.

In my smaller 4x4 boxes, I find that the 18x28" Kane mat in combo with a 21" RHP maintain the temps just fine on those nights in the high 20s.
 
Joined
Dec 16, 2019
Messages
35
Location (City and/or State)
Fresno
The reason I use the radiant oil heaters is because of their safety, reliability and effectiveness. I got the idea from a friend who was using one in a 3x3' cube box. No Insulation. Not sealed and he just had the heater sitting in the box loose on its own wheels. This was a full size radiant heater. He had it on high (1500 watts) and it was touching th side of the box, and only a few inches from the top of the box. No thermostat. It was just "on" all the time and he was using a 100 for 16 gauge extension cord draped around outside. His 100 pound tortoise could rest against it and move it.

I'm happy to report that he did this for years and never had a problem. If he can do all that, and rest the heater up against the wood, I'm not worried about a smaller, lower wattage heater, solidly mounted 6 inches from any wood and controlled by a thermostat attached to a 12 gauge cord.

I've been using them for about 10 years now in a dozen boxes around my ranch, and I've had no problems. Just recently I tried a couple of the flatter, 400 watt ones, and one of them appears to have stopped working recently after only a few years. Had to replace it. The regular style mini oil heaters last forever apparently.

I use the oil heaters in all my 4x8' boxes. Sometimes I also add a Kane mat, a RHP, or an overhead basking lamp, depending on the species and situation, in addition to the oil heater.

In my smaller 4x4 boxes, I find that the 18x28" Kane mat in combo with a 21" RHP maintain the temps just fine on those nights in the high 20s.
Thanks for this information. Can you offer any advice on arrangement of heating units, a floorplan, basically? I noticed our tortoise likes to snuggle up in corners so I anticipate putting the cane mat in a corner, with a radiant heat panel mounted to the roof above the mat. I am not sure how close to the walls I should mount the cane mat. I assume at some point the tortoise may get large enough that it will need some distance between the mat and the wall to comfortably lay on the mat?
I am also wondering where the radiator should go in relation to the mat/rhp, and the door to the house. I am also wondering how to protect the heater from the tortoise and vice versa. I saw in one of your other posts that you built a barrier around the heater with plywood and drilled holes in the plywood. I was thinking of something similar but with bigger holes (1"?). I also thought about using a few metal pipe bars instead of plywood. Any thoughts?

Matt
 

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vladimir

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Thanks for this information. Can you offer any advice on arrangement of heating units, a floorplan, basically? I noticed our tortoise likes to snuggle up in corners so I anticipate putting the cane mat in a corner, with a radiant heat panel mounted to the roof above the mat. I am not sure how close to the walls I should mount the cane mat. I assume at some point the tortoise may get large enough that it will need some distance between the mat and the wall to comfortably lay on the mat?
I am also wondering where the radiator should go in relation to the mat/rhp, and the door to the house. I am also wondering how to protect the heater from the tortoise and vice versa. I saw in one of your other posts that you built a barrier around the heater with plywood and drilled holes in the plywood. I was thinking of something similar but with bigger holes (1"?). I also thought about using a few metal pipe bars instead of plywood. Any thoughts?

Matt

I made a makeshift heat shield using sheet metal between the heater and the walls and floor, then made a little cage with 2x4s and hardware mesh




 

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