Closed chamber lights/heat...baby prep work

Sulcata_Sandy

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Tom is sending me two one-month old Sulcata babies, 60-70g respectively...one is for neighbor who's more than ready for a Sulcata...it's a gift after all her help towards me.

Anyway, the husband is building me a large closed chamber, but it will be a good 4-6 weeks, so in the interim, I will house them both in a glass tank. Not sure gallons, but it's 18x24".

I've been testing is for 3 days now, RH is steady 82%
Using an incandescent black light bulb (Thank you Yvonne for this inexpensive tip!) on one side. Top is a metal mesh reptile screen, any dead space covered with aluminum foil. Light sitting on top in a shroud (clamp lamp sans clamp)

Otherwise I wanted to use a Solar Glo (UVB Heat and light) for UV/basking. Going to set that up tonight and test temps.

Questions:

1) Is the Solar Glo most likely going to be sufficent for basking? At the moment I don't seem to have space for a third light, but I will make space if needed, as baby health is paramount.

2) can I use a CHE on a hanging socket and let it lean against the glass? Will it break the glass (heat wise, not concussive force), or can I pad it with wadded aluminum foil?

3) Is a 65w incandescent flood lamp ok for baby basking?

4) recommend brand/style of UV gun and temp probe.

And before you post links, I've read, re-read and read again Tom's articles. [GRINNING FACE WITH SMILING EYES]

In the next few months I will continue to upgrade lights/shrouds/larger enclosure. So tips, recommendations, etc all welcome. My Mediterranean torts are upgrading to UV tubes so I can buy them in bulk (thank you biochemnerd!)


Substrate is 3" back mulch, covered with 2" peat moss, covered in 2-4" sphagnum, with a moist hide, a small terra cotta dish, small stones for more surface variations, a sanitized river rock for exploring, and two large bunches of sprouted wheat grass for nibbling.
All substrate is saturated, and I mean SATURATED with warm water. An earth worm would be honored to lay in my closed chamber!


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Sandy
Oregon-Washington Tortoise Rescue

Mo the Sulcata
Larry the Jordanian Greek
Curly the Eastern Hermanni
....baby Sulcata on the way!
Lola the Basenji
Dexter the Basenji
John the boyfriend stuck in Kansas...so I get more tortoises!
 

Kapidolo Farms

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If by Solar Glo you mean the Exo Terra MVB then why are you thinking about also a 65 watt flood? I don't get it - both would provide heat, which should be calibrated by the distance from where the tortoise will sit, for optimal basking temperature. That placement is based on an actual measurement of the temp in the bulls'eye of the lamp on the substrate.

If you want heat separate from UV light, then use the less expensive combination of a T5 HO tube and fixture with as least expensive as possible incandescent flood, or better yet, spot bulb.

If you are also going to use a CHE for night heat, then just use the CHE 24/7 and let the T5 HO be the UV and illumination. Now you have just two things plugged in to monitor, not four or five. I do not think it would be safe for the CHE to be in contact with the glass. Folded up foil is not a solution, no contact is the solution.

UV guns (no such thing), heat guns, thermometers, and UV meters are all separate things. A "probe" is a remote sensor for a thermometer to get a reading.

It is OK to 'fly blind' on the UV of bulbs or tubes with a standard turnover of every six month (for tubes) or year or so (for bulbs), or no UV emitting light needed, if you get the tortoises that outside time.

Sometimes called Temp guns, more appropriately called heat guns, do not measure temperature. What? They measure irradiated energy as heat. You can Not get an "ambient" temperature with a heat gun. With two simple thermometers (about $1.99 each) you can get all the heat energy readings needed. One at the focus of heat, however you provide it, and another at the enclosure's cool end. The thermometer is usually affixed to white plastic and when placed in the focus (bulls'eye) of the heat source you will be measuring the heat output of the bulb. Then you will see how hot the tortoise has access to, not how hot the tortoise is. Basking animals know how to thermoregulate, and it provides incentive to move about (get exercise). 100 to 110F at that focus point is a good target temp for most any 'basking' species.

Heat guns gained popularity in herpetoculture for snake keepers who do not, for the most part, illuminate their pets or livestock. They used heat tape over a 20 to 50 foot length with varying hot and cold spots. In that case a heat gun provides great utility. But even the cheap $20 ones are more expensive than several thermometers that don't need batteries.

I use the inexpensive $1.99 thermometers on the cool end for each enclosure, and a $7.00 ZooMed thermometer with probe just off from the heat source Bulls'eye provided by a low wattage infra red bulb.

Two things plugged in at the most for any enclosure, no batteries required once set up and monitored for temps against the ambient of the room the enclosures are in.

Make it simple so you can enjoy the animal, not so much the tasking the animals' care will demand.

Will
 

wellington

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For UVB get the power sun bulb, seems to last longer and little problems. I would also get two 100w CHE. That is all you should need for heat. The power sun is light, heat and UVB. The only other thing you may need is more light. A regular house lamp bulb will work fine.
 

Sulcata_Sandy

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Excellent info.
I'm sorta testing the blacklist theory now, and so far it's holding the temp steady at 80°
Reportedly much easier on the electic bill than a CHE. I have several CHEs so I can swap things out.

I can't afford the PowerSun. Love it, but after the last one died, I switched to the SolarGlo that is UVB/heat/light and they De working well.

Where are you buying $1.99 thermometers????? The cheapest I've found is $7. I'd buy a case at that price! LOL
I love in a rather rural area, so selection sucks.

I was originally going to use the 24" UV tubes for the babies, but the figure just does not work with this current tank. So I'm adding those to my Mediterranean torts and swapping for the incandescent style.



Funny....reading your responses.....so obvious I was half asleep at 6am when I typed the above. LOL. Durrrrrrrrrrrrr.


-------
Sandy
Oregon-Washington Tortoise Rescue

Mo the Sulcata
Larry the Jordanian Greek
Curly the Eastern Hermanni
....baby Sulcata on the way!
Lola the Basenji
Dexter the Basenji
John the boyfriend stuck in Kansas...so I get more tortoises!
 

DeanS

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The POWERSUN is full spectrum UV...not just UVB. That is ALL you need for daytime...sunlight is better! I would put a CHE over the humid hide...and dispense with fluorescent and incandescent...completely unnecessary! Given the size of your tank...which is very small...you will only need that 100W POWERSUN and a 75W CHE ...until you upsize! And remember...anything you do is useless if you're not soaking them at least twice a day.
 

Sulcata_Sandy

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Anyone got a good source for PowerSuns that are not $50-80 plus shipping?
I got 3 SolarGlo's for $20 each, free shipping,hence the switch. [GRINNING FACE WITH SMILING EYES]

Otherwise, I agree, PowerSun is the bomb. I live in Oregon.....what is this "natural sunlight" you speak of? LOL




-------
Sandy
Oregon-Washington Tortoise Rescue

Mo the Sulcata
Larry the Jordanian Greek
Curly the Eastern Hermanni
....baby Sulcata on the way!
Lola the Basenji
Dexter the Basenji
John the boyfriend stuck in Kansas...so I get more tortoises!


BTW, thanks Dean! [SMILING FACE WITH SMILING EYES][GROWING HEART][TURTLE]


-------
Sandy
Oregon-Washington Tortoise Rescue

Mo the Sulcata
Larry the Jordanian Greek
Curly the Eastern Hermanni
....baby Sulcata on the way!
Lola the Basenji
Dexter the Basenji
John the boyfriend stuck in Kansas...so I get more tortoises!
 

Sulcata_Sandy

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Ok, I redid a few things this evening, and finally got a pic.

Removed metal mesh, replaced with getto aluminum foil...I kinds like it.

ImageUploadedByTortForum1381285240.128788.jpg

Added Solar Glo and am checking temps now...both basking and humid hide.
Going to let it "cook" all evening and see what I end up with. Babies are coming Thursday.

Replaced black light with my 125w CHE. Larry has the Blacklight now. He doesn't seem to care.

RH seems to be holding still at 82% even with only partial coverage with aluminum foil.

ImageUploadedByTortForum1381285454.941597.jpg


-------
Sandy
Oregon-Washington Tortoise Rescue

Mo the Sulcata
Larry the Jordanian Greek
Curly the Eastern Hermanni
....baby Sulcata on the way!
Lola the Basenji
Dexter the Basenji
John the boyfriend stuck in Kansas...so I get more tortoises!
 
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Sulcata_Sandy

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Overnight update:

Even after filling in some of the "holes" in my ghetto lid, I lost a significant amount of humidity. Was holding at 82%, now dropped to 72%.
Tom's care sheets are pretty insistent that humidity needs to be at 80%. Opinions?

I can mist them. Was planning on twice daily soaks anyway, so hoping that will all balance out.

The Blacklight did a better job of keeping night temperature 90°. I've had to lower the CHE deep into the tank, to about 8" off the substrate and it's finally up to 88°.


I can now TOTALLY see why you can't maintain babies with an open enclosure. I just texted neighbor asking when he can build our big closed chambers. Since these guys are a month old already, they can't stay in this small tank for long.


I'm going to begrudgingly go to Walmart today and pick up an armload of thermometers. Thanks for the tip! I hate Walmart, but I hate sick baby Sulcata even more. [SMILING FACE WITH SMILING EYES][TURTLE][PURPLE HEART]



-------
Sandy
Oregon-Washington Tortoise Rescue

Mo the Sulcata
Larry the Jordanian Greek
Curly the Eastern Hermanni
....baby Sulcata on the way!
Lola the Basenji
Dexter the Basenji
John the boyfriend stuck in Kansas...so I get more tortoises!
 

Levi the Leopard

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Just keep in mind, humidity will fluctuate even in the closed chamber. My chamber can go from 83% to 99% and back to 85% in a 24hr period without me adding water. Daytime, nighttime, what lights or heat sources are on, the ambient room temp...it all effects the chamber.


Sent from my TFOapp
 

Sulcata_Sandy

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Excellent point. It's now up to 75%.

What do you think is the lowest acceptable RH value? I'm not excited about the low 70's.



......"the chamber"....LOL
Sounds so ominous.


-------
Sandy
Oregon-Washington Tortoise Rescue

Mo the Sulcata
Larry the Jordanian Greek
Curly the Eastern Hermanni
....baby Sulcata on the way!
Lola the Basenji
Dexter the Basenji
John the boyfriend stuck in Kansas...so I get more tortoises!
 

Cowboy_Ken

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Sandy,
With Little Ricky, I shoot for, and maintain, upper 70-mid-upper 80%. I've got a humidifier with the hose and probe in the enclosure. Set it and forget it. Though I do remember to fill the reservoir bottle.
ImageUploadedByTortForum1381334380.506572.jpg

Little Ricky's enclosure is the lower one.
The jar on top is not the reservoir bottle.
 
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Sulcata_Sandy

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Those are fantastic chambers. Mind if I show those to my neighbor? I'm trying to explain to him what we need for a fast growing babies.

Current monitoring revealed:

Hide 90°
Basking/UV side 115°
RH 75%


I raises the SolarGlo 2" to reduce basking to 110°
Trying to better seal the top to increase RH.

Input? I'm rather a perfectionist, and I'm a bit OCD. Should I continue to try to reach more optimal numbers or is this acceptable and safe while my more permanent chamber is being built? He's going to try to start this weekend.


-------
Sandy
Oregon-Washington Tortoise Rescue

Mo the Sulcata
Larry the Jordanian Greek
Curly the Eastern Hermanni
....baby Sulcata on the way!
Lola the Basenji
Dexter the Basenji
John the boyfriend stuck in Kansas...so I get more tortoises!
 

Sulcata_Sandy

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Cowboy_Ken said:
Ok Sandy, give me a call. Check your pm.


Cowboy Ken

Helps if someone picks up their phone!!!! [GRINNING FACE WITH SMILING EYES]


-------
Sandy
Oregon-Washington Tortoise Rescue

Mo the Sulcata
Larry the Jordanian Greek
Curly the Eastern Hermanni
....baby Sulcata on the way!
Lola the Basenji
Dexter the Basenji
John the boyfriend stuck in Kansas...so I get more tortoises!
 

Cowboy_Ken

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Hahaha


Cowboy Ken

6 Sulcatas
8 Russians
2 Pancakes
1 Uro
7 Cats
1 Syko Dog
1 Wonderful Wife


I just said to call. I didn't indicate anywhere that I'd answer.
 

Tom

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The biggest issue I see is that the enclosure is too small and all your heating and lighting stuff is on top. You have a downward spiral of competing elements and the smaller the enclosure, the less stable it will be.

Its dry so you add water or mist. Then the additional water starts evaporating and this cools things down. Then you need more heat to warm it back up, but the added heat dries everything out faster, so you need more water. All the while your heat lamp is creating a chimney effect and sucking the warm humid air up and out, and sucking cold, dry room air in through every crack as the warm air goes up and out.

72% ambient humidity should be adequate, IF you soak daily and use a humid hide. Spraying the shell several times a day will help too.

Ken will give you good tips. He's a great guy and has first hand experience! :)
 
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