Can a Leopard's supracaudal grow too much and impede pooping?

Yvonne G

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some males have squished poop! Their anatomy does that with the anal so close to the supracaudal many times. When it becomes an issue of actual deformity and a problem - is less clear, in my opinion.

I've taken in quite a few male sulcatas and after having noticed blow flies following them around upon closer inspection, found packed poop in that area. I've had to dig it out with a screw driver. Then, if I don't find a home for them right away, I have to dig it out again in a week or so. I always let the new parents know they'll either have to have a vet widen the opening or plan on cleaning it out weekly.
 

Yvonne G

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2. On this forum I have seen many people say Leo's don't like grasses. Is this that they don't like it or not as good for them? Bob[emoji217] loved the grass in my yard... but it was freshly grown rye winter grass, maybe that is different?

I know, huh? I have quite a few leopards and they all eat grass.
 

For Love of Everything Shell

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I have nothing useful to offer on the technical side (except it all makes sense as you've explained it). But I wanted to write to give you props for caring so much for Bob. How many would clean and sanitize like you do? How many would laugh about a poop dance party and still love the pooper? And I'm guessing you are going into a bit of debt for all this vet care. Yay you and your loving heart! Lucky, lucky Bob. :<3:
Yes... about $1000 as of now and also my car is in the shop (going to be $3000 for car) so I am begging friends to take me to vet way on other side of town and to home depot for some "Bob:tort::<3: house remodel" supplies! ... and currently unemployed, hence all my time to stew and worry and over research every possible thing :(
Yippee, when it rains it pours :)

One of my friends said I should start a go fund me page for Bob... lmao

Bob's :tort: booty tuck pictures from the vet to follow (pics only show if I do them from my phone)... it hurts for me to look at them :( but I know his butt will appreciate the extra room for activities when he is all healed up! ...and for all you pros, he should receive antibiotics for the deep cutting that was done, yes?
 

For Love of Everything Shell

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I've taken in quite a few male sulcatas and after having noticed blow flies following them around upon closer inspection, found packed poop in that area. I've had to dig it out with a screw driver. Then, if I don't find a home for them right away, I have to dig it out again in a week or so. I always let the new parents know they'll either have to have a vet widen the opening or plan on cleaning it out weekly.
lol... you telling new parents, " you can either get them a Tortoise butt lift from a certified professional , or dig out poo once a week... your choice?!" lol
 

For Love of Everything Shell

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Awwwww
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My poor baby! (A booty tuck as a pre 9th Birthday present [emoji320])

Question for the Pros... antibiotics, yes? ...And any other post care advice! I have a dog (Australian Shepherd aka human in a fur suit [emoji190]) that has had surgery before... but that is far different than a tort. Obviously Bob[emoji217] does not need the "cone of shame"!
 

For Love of Everything Shell

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Oh wow! Much better. I'm sure he'll thank you once it heals and he's able to get rid of those piles and piles of poo!
So that is a standard trim? Yes much more room!!! even the before picture he sent me the vet had already trimmed off the "original baby tort supracaudal scute" so probably another 1/4 of an inch of close for the "before" !!!
 

Markw84

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Interesting. The problem to me seems to be the anal scutes grew much too much to the rear instead of flaring outward. The supracaudal did not look much different than a "normal" male leopard. But the anals looked much different. They normally flare outward and to not have much front to back growth to the anals. The ANALS were too big!
 

For Love of Everything Shell

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:eek: WOW!
That "Before" picture really does look like he was almost closed up like a box!!!!!! :confused:

I thought that was normal booty protection!

I clearly have a classy young man that still believes in modesty and chivalry (he always greets me when I come home and gives me foot massages, aka walks over my feet back and forth while I was dishes at the sink! ;))
 

For Love of Everything Shell

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Interesting. The problem to me seems to be the anal scutes grew much too much to the rear instead of flaring outward. The supracaudal did not look much different than a "normal" male leopard. But the anals looked much different. They normally flare outward and to not have much front to back growth to the anals. The ANALS were too big!
huh ... well all around trimmed up now! and if Bob:tort: ever does find a tortoise lady he wants to play "hide and seek" with... I would think he has enough left to prop himself up on, yes?
 

Moozillion

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huh ... well all around trimmed up now! and if Bob:tort: ever does find a tortoise lady he wants to play "hide and seek" with... I would think he has enough left to prop himself up on, yes?
Oh, if he ever has a hot date, he'll find a way! Trust me: HE'S A GUY!!!!!!:D
(With apologies to ALL the wonderful guys on this forum!!! ;) )
 

For Love of Everything Shell

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Bob[emoji217] Update:
So he came home on Saturday and we have been taking it slow ... lots of warm soaks and supervised outdoor sunshine time for grass grazing and obviously the sunshine [emoji295]️!!! As crazy hot as it is here, I endure as long as I can while I am making plans for his outdoor daytime "play pen"

... sooo he had a few doses of antibiotics at the vet before he left and got out a healthy poop last Friday, allegedly. Still no poops at home!

Yesterday his shell trim coloring looked a bit off. He is staying super clean and has no substrate or dirt in sight (intentionally for wound healing) ... and soaks after outdoor time to clean him up.

Today (Tuesday) was his phone call follow up ... (in person follow up in 2 weeks) and... his coloring is definitely green today, so I informed the vet and sent the attached picture.

Bob[emoji217] is now back at the vet for an overnight stay and assessment, they think even though the wound was sealed with a sterile topical (explained to me as similar to a liquid skin/superglue/quick clot sealant ) he might have mold growth or some kind of infection [emoji22]

You can see if you look up close in person that where his leg rubs on the new shell surface, I think he may have rubbed off the coating and some coodies got underneath [emoji24][emoji22][emoji22][emoji24]

My heart aches for him and this long ordeal!

He doesn't seem to mind as he still had fun outside today and the free range of course! I had to take him inside early to prep for my friend to take us to the vet so I picked some extra grass for him. He devoured the extra grass I picked ...after I smeared it in pumpkin of course! IMG_3038.jpg IMG_3037.jpg IMG_3041.jpg IMG_3039.jpg IMG_3036.jpg IMG_3035.jpg
 

For Love of Everything Shell

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Bob[emoji217] Update: Take 32!

He is back home from the vet again. They believe the discoloration was just in the shell sealant as when they scraped it off the wound color was normal. They gave him another dose of antibiotics just to be safe and reapplied the sealant. I was also informed that during his vet slumber party he had a healthy sized poo!!!
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When I asked how much, she just said... ahhh I was told it was a lot lol

I was also informed to cut back his recovery soaks to only one a day for no more than 15 minutes, in case that is what caused the sealant discoloration.

This morning Bob[emoji217] had a poo [emoji90] present for me also! (About 4 in long and an inch-ish wide!!! Twice the girth of any previous normal poop he has gifted to me before! It was also a bit light colored-likely from the syringe feeding at the vet for a week, contained some Timothy hay, but not in excess, also contained mostly normal poo texture!)
No poop dancing party! Thank goodness [emoji6], just one foot print squish lol, clearly he is keeping it classy with his new 2bedroom bachelor pad, and he pooped just outside his front door lol

His indoor bachelor pad upgrades are still underway, but coming along [emoji16] he is loving the 2 bedroom aspect of it for sure [emoji217][emoji7] and has slowly ventured into the second cooler room to sleep [emoji16].

I also have finally put together this raised planter that I have had and I am using it as his outdoor play pen/grazing grounds/natural sunshine containment During times of indoor bachelor pad construction. I just flip it over and then set up half of the "bottom pieces" to make a shaded hide, and then he has an 8'x2' grazing run (I think he likes it as he always walks along the fence line outside anyways...)

For his indoor house... his radiant heat panel, thermostat, and uvb light are all in the mail... soooo... soon, hopefully?!? [emoji16][emoji16][emoji16]

Still no substrate inside because of his shell wounds, but soon I hope!

If you zoom in you can see him in the shaded zone. I also have a piece of chain link to put on top of the open end... if I put him out and I am not going to be home to be on "predator critter watch" [emoji16]
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For Love of Everything Shell

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Bob[emoji217]Update: post booty tuck!

Bob[emoji217] had his final vet visit follow up appointment and he received gold stars in all categories! And bonus points in the sass and personality! [emoji294]️[emoji294]️[emoji294]️[emoji294]️[emoji294]️

The tech that bonded with him the most was so happy to see him again and give him little armpit tickles! (She said his little armpit "meats" were her favorite part to scratch and tickle, lol). It was wonderful to see how much they all clearly tended to him and got to know him during his medical stay!

Dr. Rich... I LOVE HIM!!! He gave me a big hug when he came into the room and had on the proud parent face as if to say "I told you we would make it through this!" He was very dedicated to doing the extra research and reaching out to his colleagues in the industry (some are leading tortoise and reptile researchers [emoji33][emoji16]) ! In the end it all was worth it... Bob[emoji217]'s poops are now twice the girth as before ... more like a slightly squished snickers .... or the "fun sized" snickers... rather than ribbons of small bite sized tootsie rolls (I should stop comparing his poop [emoji90]shapes to food... sorry )

Oh and on the list of my final questions to the Dr. Rich... Bob[emoji217]'s poop really doesn't have a smell anymore! I mean before I would know he pooped before I even opened the door! (Was a bad ammonia ish pungent one, his pee also was far more fragrant). I thought maybe this was because his body might still be processing out his antibiotics he received, but Dr. Rich says it is likely back to shell shape! He said just like in humans the longer we hold it the more bacteria reproduce ... and That since he couldn't go poop as easily or frequently... it is likely that the bacteria would add up and then when he would go it was fragrant! I will add an update if his poop goes back to some stinky-ness, but what a hidden benefit to a shell/booty tuck ! [emoji6]

He also said it would take some time before deeply trimmed areas would heal over and convert to more of a normal shell color, but as long as there is NO discharge, swelling, odd color changes, or foul smell... alll is on track!

All and all... thank you for all of you supporting me through the crazy and for sharing your expertise!
I also told Dr. Rich about the forum and how I have posted everything so hopefully others might some day be saved by the information posted! ... I also told him about the tortoise supply website that sells the perfectly blended nutritionally balanced seed blends for tortoises! He loved that idea (obviously I will stay away from the extra dry and not as easily digested Timothy hay) . I also shared the need of a small shell curl for Leo [emoji217]men to effectively breed with the ladies ! (I can't remember whom shared that info to give credit ?... )

Well... thank you again!
Happy tort-ing
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