Boxie Hatchling Care

StarSapphire22

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Recently, I've been looking into getting a trio of EBT hatchlings. Pretty much the only thing stopping me is still needing a definite "yes" from my fiance...but I think I can win him over. :p The thing is, there just isn't much info out there regarding box turtles, what is out there is sometimes conflicting, and there's pretty much NOTHING on hatchlings. I have a Hermann's who is just short of a year old now, so I'm not completely new to this, and I know that boxies need extra wetness/a swimming area and protein/fruit in addition to their greens.

This is the information I have gotten so far from Chris, who I would be purchasing from. Obviously, everyone uses different methods.
The best way to set them up is in a closed Rubbermaid container filled with top soil, cypress mulch and sphagnum moss. They do not need much light because all baby box turtles do in the wild is hide until they are of a less vulnerable size. They tend to freak out in bright light or open areas. You would just want to keep them in a warm room. You really don't need any added heat or light until they're between 3-4". An MVB would be way way too much. You'll fine conflicting views about this subject but I'm telling you, this is the way to raise them. They will grow perfectly smooth and stay well hydrated and fat. They can NEVER dry out like a tortoise can. They must always be moist, damp, even wet. A 55 gallon is too big in my opinion. I would go with something that's around 2 feet long and a foot wide. They don't need much room and will only be 1-1.5". If you want to any light at all, simply do a 5.0 or 10.0 strip bulb. And that's it. Do not believe the info that states they need a hot basking area, it couldn't be any further from the truth and it will kill them.

I'd really like input from those who have raised box turtle hatchlings on the methods you use (pictures of your setup would be great too!). I also have some noob questions.

1) I've read that they will need/eat more protein when young...is this true?
2) I was thinking something like a paint tray to start them off for their "swimming pool" so they could choose the depth. Would this work? Do I need to worry about the little ones swimming, being too deep, drowning, etc.? I know adults swim pretty well, but not so sure about the babies. Would a large clay saucer be better?
3) I know they need lots of wetness...do they need a dry area at all? Is shell rot a concern with boxies?
4) I know they do better in colder temps than our torts do...but is 70-75 (our room temp, usually closer to 75) TOO cold? If it is too cold, how do I warm them up without being too bright/too hot? Do I need to worry about RIs from wet+cold?
5) What is the ratio of plant matter:fruit:protein at this age? How does it change as they get older? How do you ensure they're getting the proper amounts of each? What kind of feeding schedule do you use?

The first year or two, these guys will be kept indoors, with trips outside when weather permits. Right now, I live in an apartment in North Dakota, so there is a limited time of the year where weather is nice. Hopefully, next fall we will be moving to CA to finish our degrees and outside time will be more frequent. The ultimate goal is a big garden/pond for these guys, maybe adding a few more to the group down the road. I've been really wanting boxies for a long time, so I asked for three as a starter to my group as my wedding gift from my fiancee (we get married in August, around when Chris' babies will be hatching). I've asked for a temperature sexed male and 2 females, so hopefully they will turn out that way. :)

Any input from those who have raised little boxies before would be greatly appreciated. Maybe we can get enough info here to get this stickied for other prospective owners! :)
 

Yvonne G

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In my opinion, the number one most important thing to remember about baby box turtles is that they are SO tiny, they dehydrate very quickly. They benefit from a very wet environment.

You can't go wrong listening to what Chris tells you.

747117wei24kafiu.gif
 

StarSapphire22

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Chris is pretty smart! If he tells me to raise a turtle/tort a certain way, that's how I'll do it...but I have a lot of questions and he's very busy with nesting season there, and I didn't want to pester him anymore.

Since they dehydrate so quickly then, I'm assuming there's no need for a dry area?
 

Yvonne G

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No. I keep mine in a sterlite tub that's on a slant (a brick under one end). The bottom of the tub is very wet, almost swimming-type wet and it's still damp up towards the top end, but not wet.

747117wei24kafiu.gif
 

StarSapphire22

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Would you do daily soaks like for tort babies? Or is the moisture and swimming area enough?
 

dannel

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Is there a problem with housing them in a larger enclosure? I am planning on putting my baby EBT in a 2' x 4' closed chamber.
 

Elohi

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Is there a problem with housing them in a larger enclosure? I am planning on putting my baby EBT in a 2' x 4' closed chamber.
I would think that's would be fine, just remember the larger the enclosure for these tiny things, the harder to find them. ;)


Elohi(Earth)
 

dannel

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So is there a real risk to not being able to find em? I would think they would come out to eat and for a misting, etc.
 

StarSapphire22

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So is there a real risk to not being able to find em? I would think they would come out to eat and for a misting, etc.

Not necessarily. You might not see them much at all, some will hide when you come near just to sneak food when you're not looking, at least for a while.

Bigger is better in a lot of ways, but with one quarter-sized hatchling, a 2x4 may be a bit excessive and more work for you to maintain. 4 feet is also a lot further to travel to get to water, food, favorite hide, etc. for a 1" hatchling than a juvie or adult. I think you would find that a hatchling may not even utilize all that space if it didn't have to. My 3" Hermann's yearling has a 4'x1.5' enclosure, and this will last him for some time still, just to put that into perspective. You could easily use a rubbermaid bin (already waterproof, opaque sides to block light and outside stressors, and less than $20.00) instead of constructing a closed chamber.
 

StarSapphire22

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I'd really appreciate some input from those who have raised boxie hatchlings on their setups (pictures too? :D ), and answers to my questions in my original post. @Saleama @shellfreak ? I'm sure there are more I'm forgetting.
 

dannel

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Not necessarily. You might not see them much at all, some will hide when you come near just to sneak food when you're not looking, at least for a while.

Bigger is better in a lot of ways, but with one quarter-sized hatchling, a 2x4 may be a bit excessive and more work for you to maintain. 4 feet is also a lot further to travel to get to water, food, favorite hide, etc. for a 1" hatchling than a juvie or adult. I think you would find that a hatchling may not even utilize all that space if it didn't have to. My 3" Hermann's yearling has a 4'x1.5' enclosure, and this will last him for some time still, just to put that into perspective. You could easily use a rubbermaid bin (already waterproof, opaque sides to block light and outside stressors, and less than $20.00) instead of constructing a closed chamber.

Thanks for the suggestion, but unfortunately my current situation wont permit me to use a rubbermaid. I have a very curious cat, who has unfortunately "socialized" with our bird before. I would prefer to avoid any mishaps with the little turtle, so I am making a cat-proof closed chamber. It's not financially reasonable for me to make a small closed chamber, a medium closed chamber, and then a large one. Could I just section some of the large one off so the boxie has maybe, 2x2' to roam in?
 

StarSapphire22

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Thanks for the suggestion, but unfortunately my current situation wont permit me to use a rubbermaid. I have a very curious cat, who has unfortunately "socialized" with our bird before. I would prefer to avoid any mishaps with the little turtle, so I am making a cat-proof closed chamber. It's not financially reasonable for me to make a small closed chamber, a medium closed chamber, and then a large one. Could I just section some of the large one off so the boxie has maybe, 2x2' to roam in?

You could do that...or you could use the lid that comes with the bin. Just saying. :p I have 3 cats and have done so with no problems.
 

lisa127

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I've raised two baby box turtles and one juvenile. I pretty much followed the low light, high humidity way of thinking. I did keep a moonglo bulb on for heat so it's not like I had no heat. But I used the black moonglo and never a white incandescent as that would be way too bright. I used a 5.0 UVB tube in the middle of the enclosure. Lots of damp long fibred sphagnum moss for hiding in. I did not do daily soaks. I just made sure they were kept in a slightly damp, humid environment and always had access to soaking water in the enclosure. As far as temps, I followed the same temps as for adults.
 

dannel

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Really? You put the lights inside and everything? The only problem i see is that my cat is REALLLLLLLLLLLY fat.... so fat that i would be concerned the lid would collapse in. Maybe im just paranoid.
 

StarSapphire22

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I've raised two baby box turtles and one juvenile. I pretty much followed the low light, high humidity way of thinking. I did keep a moonglo bulb on for heat so it's not like I had no heat. But I used the black moonglo and never a white incandescent as that would be way too bright. I used a 5.0 UVB tube in the middle of the enclosure. Lots of damp long fibred sphagnum moss for hiding in. I did not do daily soaks. I just made sure they were kept in a slightly damp, humid environment and always had access to soaking water in the enclosure. As far as temps, I followed the same temps as for adults.

Thanks Lisa! What were your temps in your setup?
 

shellfreak

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Everyone has their little tricks. Chris is brilliant when it comes to box turtles, etc. The only thing I do differently is offer them an hour of heat a day. It's on a timer from 12pm-1pm. I found that when I started doing this, they became a little more active. I also use a UVB light that doesn't emit heat. I keep that on for 8 hours. My set up mimics a forest floor. Lots of places to hide and burrow. The substrate I use is a mixture of cypress mulch, forest floor, natural dirt from outside and leaves. I mix it all together and freeze it over night to kill any bacteria or bugs, etc. I keep this substrate very moist for the first 2 years. Almost like a mud. I don't keep them in a rubber maid, mainly Bc I enjoy looking at them. Some people claim it causes stress Bc they constantly are trying to find a way out. I find that if you keep the tank full of things to do (obstacles) you will be fine. And if they do spend time trying to escape, it gives them exercise...I like to keep the diet as natural as possible. So I order pill bugs, maggots, pinhead crickets, worms and pretty much anything that moves. It allows them to naturally hunt. I don't offer any fruits or vegetables until they are at least 3-4 years old. I do occasionally put a sliced strawberry in the tank, but will place it in a bush up high so only the crickets can eat it. I've been doing this for about 6 years now and I lose my occasional hatchling, but most survive to eventually find new homes.
 

johnsonnboswell

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You can use hardware cloth to keep cats out. It is cheap. It's not cloth, it's a rigid screen.
 

lisa127

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As for diet, I always offered my babies fruits/veggies. They were picking at them by 6 months of age and eating them regularly by Id say 1.5 years of age. In fact, two of my babies are turning 3 years old this summer and eat fruit/veggies as 50% of their diet....just like an adult would.
 

StarSapphire22

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Everyone has their little tricks. Chris is brilliant when it comes to box turtles, etc. The only thing I do differently is offer them an hour of heat a day. It's on a timer from 12pm-1pm. I found that when I started doing this, they became a little more active. I also use a UVB light that doesn't emit heat. I keep that on for 8 hours. My set up mimics a forest floor. Lots of places to hide and burrow. The substrate I use is a mixture of cypress mulch, forest floor, natural dirt from outside and leaves. I mix it all together and freeze it over night to kill any bacteria or bugs, etc. I keep this substrate very moist for the first 2 years. Almost like a mud. I don't keep them in a rubber maid, mainly Bc I enjoy looking at them. Some people claim it causes stress Bc they constantly are trying to find a way out. I find that if you keep the tank full of things to do (obstacles) you will be fine. And if they do spend time trying to escape, it gives them exercise...I like to keep the diet as natural as possible. So I order pill bugs, maggots, pinhead crickets, worms and pretty much anything that moves. It allows them to naturally hunt. I don't offer any fruits or vegetables until they are at least 3-4 years old. I do occasionally put a sliced strawberry in the tank, but will place it in a bush up high so only the crickets can eat it. I've been doing this for about 6 years now and I lose my occasional hatchling, but most survive to eventually find new homes.

Thanks Shellfreak! Do you use a regular bulb or a blacklight bulb for that hour? Chris is DEFINITELY brilliant! I will be following his advice for sure, but all my reptile keeping experience and instincts are shouting "what, no heat?!" I totally trust him, but old habits die hard, lol.

I would love to look at my little ones too, but I was worried that if I kept them in an aquarium or similar, that too much external light would come in. They'd be in our living room, so there's activity and light and all that jazz. Would that be too much? So much that I've read makes these guys sound like they're afraid of everything...I don't want to spook them!

Whatever I keep them in, my plans are to heavily plant, give lots of hides, and keep wet. :) Can they swim yet, while they're this little? Do I need to worry about drowning, etc.?
 
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