Anyone experience this behavior?

Skip K

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After way too long...have redesigned and expanded the boxies enclosure ( over doubling the initial enclosure space)...I’ve noticed the boxies seem very reluctant to utilize this new space. They stop at the place where a wall was ( now removed because of the expansion) and will only look at the added on area...as though there is an invisible wall still there. I have put them all in the new space...they mill around...then head back and stay in the original enclosure space. It’s the 3rd day now.
But on a positive note...the boxies are feasting on the cicadas ( even the pond frogs are getting a belly full).
 

Yvonne G

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Just another example of how territorial they are. Give them time.

I was watching animal videos the other day and someone put a bowl containing three goldfish in a larger aquarium filled with water. None of the fish swam out.
 

ZenHerper

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No worries - turtles are creatures of habit and territory. They like it where it is familiar. Soon enough they will take over the rest of the renovation...as soon as they are sure there are no predators living over there. lol

These are well-seasoned cicadas this year!
 

Skip K

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Thank you, Yvonne and Zen Herper. Busted my ***...time, effort and wood costs...with my son... tearing down most of the old enclosure ( 20 years it lasted and it was suppose to be temporary)...and thought the boxies would be overjoyed. Lol...and after all that...they just stared at the new space...totally anticlimactic. So much for instant gratification!
 

Skip K

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Empathy, gratitude, reciprocity...all pro-social stuff that reptiles don't have in their repertoire.

If you post some photos, we'll Ooo and Ahh in their place...

=DD
Lol...this part of the expansion...this includes a smaller mini pond ( maybe it’ll keep the boxies from plopping into the Black Wood Turtles 80 gallon pond which is in the original part of enclosure)...some ribbon grass that will spread ( this would be nice since anything I try to plant in the tortoise enclosures gets eaten immediately)...also a section that includes a mixture of sand, original soil, and organic soil as a nesting site ( have had eggs before...but none fertile) and some left over Repti-bark...for some humidity. This pic is from today...also...since every spring I clean out the bigger pond and because of waiting for the chlorine to dissipate...I capture the frogs and keep them in a aquarium till the water is safe. Here is one of the not so happy frogs...( but they are not so unhappy as to not eat the cicadas I put in the aquarium).
 

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ZenHerper

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Oooo - private pool!

Ahhh - grass!

Cool frog!

That does look like a lot of work: I'm sure they'll be ungrateful enough to continue using the pond. =DD Most people don't know how much boxies love to swim, and are very good at it.

You might try ferns or giant-leaf Hostas in large pots dug down enough to be stable but not so the turts can get up into them. Gives an immediate 'scaped appearance and more hiding spots. If you buy from a standard garden shop, unpot, rinse, and repot the plants in organic soil. The entire bottom of the pots can be cut out to allow for drainage and root establishment.
 

Skip K

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Oooo - private pool!

Ahhh - grass!

Cool frog!

That does look like a lot of work: I'm sure they'll be ungrateful enough to continue using the pond. =DD Most people don't know how much boxies love to swim, and are very good at it.

You might try ferns or giant-leaf Hostas in large pots dug down enough to be stable but not so the turts can get up into them. Gives an immediate 'scaped appearance and more hiding spots. If you buy from a standard garden shop, unpot, rinse, and repot the plants in organic soil. The entire bottom of the pots can be cut out to allow for drainage and root establishment.
Funny you should mention Hostas. The tortoises buzzsawed the hostas to the ground in their enclosures...every time a couple leaves try to come back...buzzsawed to the ground again. I’m going to dig up what’s left of them and plant them in the boxies enclosure. Frogs will like the extra cover as well
 

jeff kushner

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Yeah, kind of typical & Zen nailed it. Turtles, as much as we all personify them, are driven by instinct, little else. They roam b/c their DNA is programed to roam in search of food/mates but remember that they have little defense to predation so they view things differently than we do for instance because being eaten when going somewhere usually isn't our 1st concern. Provide those things on the other side of the invisible wall, they will find them.

I had a 3-4ft Caiman in the 70's that I tried to "tame&train"....doesn't work as they are also instinctual animals. They WILL follow their instinct. Hindsight has taught me that attempting this with an ambush predator was foolish at best.

That I still possess all my fingers is testament that I learned this in advance of getting the caiman. You "think" they are relaxed.......and you think they "get you".....right up until its time to eat......lol

Sorry, middle of the night ramblings....

I went back to look at your new/improved home Skip and it's nice! Good cover area, easy sight picture for our little guys since it's flat & a pool!!
 

Skip K

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Yeah, kind of typical & Zen nailed it. Turtles, as much as we all personify them, are driven by instinct, little else. They roam b/c their DNA is programed to roam in search of food/mates but remember that they have little defense to predation so they view things differently than we do for instance because being eaten when going somewhere usually isn't our 1st concern. Provide those things on the other side of the invisible wall, they will find them.

I had a 3-4ft Caiman in the 70's that I tried to "tame&train"....doesn't work as they are also instinctual animals. They WILL follow their instinct. Hindsight has taught me that attempting this with an ambush predator was foolish at best.

That I still possess all my fingers is testament that I learned this in advance of getting the caiman. You "think" they are relaxed.......and you think they "get you".....right up until its time to eat......lol

Sorry, middle of the night ramblings....

I went back to look at your new/improved home Skip and it's nice! Good cover area, easy sight picture for our little guys since it's flat & a pool!!
Jeff...something you said made me think. The original part of the enclosure...after years of adding grass clippings and leaves in the fall for the boxies to burrow into for hibernating...has turned into “flooring”...raising the ground level about 4 inches higher than the ground outside of the enclosure...as well as being 4 inches higher than the new addition. I graded the difference between the two levels into a gentle, gradual slope. But maybe that isn’t good enough and they don’t like even a slight change in topography at first. Also...what might come into play is the “ground” between the sections is different.. as mentioned above..one has the years of built up and broken down grass and leaf “flooring”...while the new section is basically just dirt right now. That is why I furrow raked the new area and added the repti-bark. Maybe I should go to my compost pile and dig out some of the older decayed compost and rake that into the new additions. Maybe smell..or consistency plays a part in making them feel more at home.
 
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Skip K

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Jeff...something you said made me think. The original part of the enclosure...after years of adding grass clippings and leaves in the fall for the boxies to burrow into for hibernating...has turned into “flooring”...raising the ground level about 4 inches higher than the ground outside of the enclosure...as well as being 4 inches higher than the new addition. I graded the difference between the two levels into a gentle, gradual slope. But maybe that isn’t good enough and they don’t like even a slight change in topography at first. Also...what might come into play is the “ground” between the sections is different.. as mentioned above..one has the years of built up and broken down grass and leaf “flooring”...while the new section is basically just dirt right now. That is why I furrow raked the new area and added the repti-bark. Maybe I should go to my compost pile and dig out some of the older decayed compost and rake that into the new additions. Maybe smell..or consistency plays a part in making them feel more at home.
And it’s still a work in progress..too. Wood shortages...I couldn’t get all pressure treated wood...so I have to paint the non treated lumber. Also...I have still have one more cover to build. I built a new cover for the old section...but need to make a cover for the new section. Because of predators...all my enclosures have to have hinged wire mesh covers that can hold up to 30lb raccoons ...which is quite a challenge considering the size of the enclosures. Right now all I’m just laying the old, decaying wire cover from the original enclosure...over the new addition. Gonna take a few days off before building the last cover...as my hands are pretty chewed up from the wire... building the one I finished.
 

Maggie3fan

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Lol...this part of the expansion...this includes a smaller mini pond ( maybe it’ll keep the boxies from plopping into the Black Wood Turtles 80 gallon pond which is in the original part of enclosure)...some ribbon grass that will spread ( this would be nice since anything I try to plant in the tortoise enclosures gets eaten immediately)...also a section that includes a mixture of sand, original soil, and organic soil as a nesting site ( have had eggs before...but none fertile) and some left over Repti-bark...for some humidity. This pic is from today...also...since every spring I clean out the bigger pond and because of waiting for the chlorine to dissipate...I capture the frogs and keep them in a aquarium till the water is safe. Here is one of the not so happy frogs...( but they are not so unhappy as to not eat the cicadas I put in the aquarium).
Ohhh aweeeee so kool!
 

jeff kushner

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I's a great looking home! "30lb raccoons"?? Holy geez bud, you been feeding them well!

Price/avail of items is our reality. I am a chief estimator for a large construction firm on the DC beltway and we are seeing 6 months out....if you have a swimming pool and use chlorine, buy it NOW if it hasn't already skyrocketed. Charlotte pipe company is suspending all PVC piping above 6" right now due to lack of chlorine. Steel has jumped over 300%.....give it 4 months to hit the market.....yeah, it's ugly when a sheet of 1/2 plywood is nearing 100 bucks!


I replaced some 16' deck boards last summer (paid $26 each I think)and over-ordered so I'm golden for the walls of my outdoor home I'm planning. I was thinking of using my old front screen door as a hinged lid so I could install glass in the winter, screen in the summer......but we have coons, possums and foxes here....do you think that screen door will work? I could replace the screening with that 1/4" wire mesh roll but it's going to look hokey. What was your pool from? I like the textured bottom!

I never realized how much topography had to do with enclosures until I renovated the Reptile House at a zoo in DC. The folks there were amazing, top to bottom and like most of us, it was their passion of sorts so I got to learn what they knew!
 

Skip K

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I hear you, Jeff, on pricing. And about the beltway...I can hear the traffic quite clearly from my house...lol
 

Jan A

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I's a great looking home! "30lb raccoons"?? Holy geez bud, you been feeding them well!

Price/avail of items is our reality. I am a chief estimator for a large construction firm on the DC beltway and we are seeing 6 months out....if you have a swimming pool and use chlorine, buy it NOW if it hasn't already skyrocketed. Charlotte pipe company is suspending all PVC piping above 6" right now due to lack of chlorine. Steel has jumped over 300%.....give it 4 months to hit the market.....yeah, it's ugly when a sheet of 1/2 plywood is nearing 100 bucks!


I replaced some 16' deck boards last summer (paid $26 each I think)and over-ordered so I'm golden for the walls of my outdoor home I'm planning. I was thinking of using my old front screen door as a hinged lid so I could install glass in the winter, screen in the summer......but we have coons, possums and foxes here....do you think that screen door will work? I could replace the screening with that 1/4" wire mesh roll but it's going to look hokey. What was your pool from? I like the textured bottom!

I never realized how much topography had to do with enclosures until I renovated the Reptile House at a zoo in DC. The folks there were amazing, top to bottom and like most of us, it was their passion of sorts so I got to learn what they knew!
Racoons can open just about anything, including gate latches & door handles & climbing down chimneys. And it's amazing how many YUGE turds they can leave on your roof.
 

Skip K

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Racoons can open just about anything, including gate latches & door handles & climbing down chimneys. And it's amazing how many YUGE turds they can leave on your roof.
And they will tear up your yard looking for grubs...and I mean TEAR UP like it was rototilled!
 

Jan A

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And if you catch one in a cat trap, then open the door, it will run and keep on running until it gets to Canada.


I hear...
We would haul caught raccoons out to the country before letting them loose. There were always 3 or 15 more to replace the one we caught. It was hard to make progress. We came home late 1 night & Mama & 3 or 4 more little ones peered at us from the top of our 7 foot high fence
 

ZenHerper

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We would haul caught raccoons out to the country before letting them loose. There were always 3 or 15 more to replace the one we caught. It was hard to make progress. We came home late 1 night & Mama & 3 or 4 more little ones peered at us from the top of our 7 foot high fence
In town, they were few and pretty small (~15 pounds). But that one did like the smell of tuna. lol You could hear the leaves and twigs as he ran up and over the hills above the house.

I swear he's still running. And that was 20 years back...

=DD
 

jeff kushner

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My sister moved to Broomfield, then Boulder in the early 70's....... the problem animals were bears & cougars......be happy Jan!

Most folks really have no idea how dangerous a racoon CAN be. They have nearly 3" front claws and can lay a dogs face on the ground. They are not fast but are amazingly quick. We used to catch them as kids in our Havahart traps.....and yes, they haul when the end of the trap is opened. We had pete and charlie with their bb guns trained on the cage when we let the 1st one go because we were afraid it would turn to fight.....we needn't have worried LMAO.....

Yeah, I've been trying to kid myself for a few weeks about using that screen door, you guys are right of course....the latch can be "proofed" but that screen sure can't......hmmmm
 
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