Advise on Hibernating for the First time! Please help

[JemmaANDPebbles]

Hi I’m jemma, I have two Spur Thighed Tortoises – Pebbles and Marbles They was 2 in July this year. I have been told not to hibernate them until they are 3years old but this year I am struggling to keep them awake. The weather has changed here and has gone very cold and frosty, I’m sure they can sense it. Every day I am having to wake them up and put them under the lamps, normally they wake up themselves and are extremely lively and are wanting to get out of their enclosure but lately they are sleeping all the time. I think it is unfair to keep doing this to them and Marbles is very grumpy with me, So I am going to Hibernate them for a few weeks at least.
I need to know what everyone else did the first time the hibernated their tortoise? And when? Is now too early?
I know you have to make sure their stomachs are empty, and not to feed them two weeks before and you have to cool them down, does that mean I don’t put their lamps on for the two weeks before i hibernate them?
How long shall I hibernate them for?

According to Jacksons ratio they are at an ideal weight and they are also both measuring over 100mm

Any advise would be appreciated!
Jemma

thanks from Pebbles and Marbles

 

[Terry Allan Hall]

I, like many modern pet tortoise-keepers, have, in about 40 years of sharing my life w/ these delightful beasties, never brumated* my tortoises, as there's no advantage to it, really. Allowing them to remain awake does not shorten their lives, keep them from breeding, or any of the other myths once thought to be Gospel.

OTOH, even in the wild, and at least as often in captivity, some tortoises do not survive brumation, for various reasons.

Just create "summer conditions" via light-hours and temperatures and they'll be happy little torts, and you can enjoy them, year-round. And you can daily monitor their health, so as to catch any issues promptly.

*Tortoises really don't hibernate, per se, and this confusion of terms may've lead to quite a few tragedies.

 

[CactusVinnie]

Hi Jemma!

First, please post pics of your tortoises, as clear as possible: carapace, plastron and lateral. When geographical origin cleared at least largely, we will see what to do next.
I do not want to repeat the Gospels, but:
- tortoises do not die on brumation, unless mistakes done. Avoid them and it will be ok.
- tortoises brumate/hibernate from their first year, at about 2-3 months of age; nobody keps them happy and awake and winters in habitat can range from mild as S-New Mexico to harsh as S-Alberta.
- there is no confusion leading to tragedies, although the terms define somewhat different notions; in our context means "a 2-5 months sleep in cold conditions, with or rather without occasional awakening episodes", no matter how you want to call it. I would try "brubernation", in order to cover all the variants. I always tried to use the term as it is used in every place I visit and write, but I always inclined towards "hibernation", as it is easier to get and better known.

So, let's see if your torts are "brubernators" or not, first of all. Until then, you can read the link in my signature.

Cheers!

 

[Yvonne G]

Hi Jemma:

Sometimes its pretty hard to keep a tortoise awake that is determined to brumate. What I do in that instance is to allow them a 2 week brumation. I will box them up in a cardboard box stuffed with newspapers and place the box in a cool spot like a back bedroom closet and leave it there for two weeks. At the end of that time I'll get the tortoise up, soak him and place him back in his habitat, with the lights and heat on for at least 14 hours a day. Usually this will fool the tortoise into thinking he has brumated and its ok for him to wake back up. And 2 weeks without eating isn't going to hurt him.

 

[CactusVinnie]

Yvonne, that's a working trick, and you can keep it that way all winter, repeating this scheme. It's exactly what I describe in the signature link!

 

[JemmaANDPebbles]

Thank you all for your advice, I have decided that I will brumate them for two weeks, and see how they are after that. I was wandering shall I still not feed them for a while before i allow then to Brumate? They are not eating much at the moment anyway, but I’m sure they will still have something in their stomachs?

Thanks Jemma

 

[CactusVinnie]

Jemma, forgot the pics!! If a tender African, only the method from signature can be used.
Yes, the hardy subspecies can be "intermittent" brumated like in the method described in my signature (read it!), but what type of parameters will you have- temperatures, box, filling? Transition week, method?
Please always ask before and please give me the asked informations; GIGO in computers, meaning "garbage in, garbage out"= wrong or incomplete infos from you means a wrong answer from me, and danger for your tortoise.

Usually, you don't subject the youngs to warm, fast-burning wind-down hunger only to offer them... what, only 2 weeks of rest?? It is not metabolic... "lucrative". Too much ordeal for too little benefit.

For 10 cm animals, stopping food should be done 1 week before beginning cooling/light reducing, as follows:

- week 1- normal summer regime 14Light/10Dark, same for heat bulb, bath every 2 days, for 15-30 minutes, if they accept 30;
- week 2- 12Light/12Dark, but heat bulb only 10 hours on; ambient temp. 15-20*C; idem baths;
- week 3- 10Light/14Dark, heat bulb 5 hours on; ambient temp 10-15*C; idem baths
- week 4- 10Light/14Dark, no heat bulb, no baths, ambient 10*C;
- week 5- entering hibernaculum.
You bathe them only when warm and active, and in 27-30*C water. No bath to cold animals, no bath when no heat-bulb!
Slightly humid hides should be provided all the time.

During the wind-down 4 weeks, the hibernacullum temperature should be already balanced at 7-10*C, and during the week 5 and 6 (tortoises already inside), you should go to 5*C. If you feel insecure of changing fridge settings- and that can be sometimes risky, indeed- just manage to obtain stability around 5*C and put the 10*C tortoise inside, since the box will buffer the 5*C plunge.
Accept only variations between 3-7*C, for safety. Even if down to just above freezing is no problem, it may be problem if the fridge thermostat (if you choose fridge) is not very precise and, during a brutal cooling, can fall under zero! So, the extremes should be placed safely, never allowing under 3*C. That should be the accepted accident, not the rule. If it's the rule, accidents may plunge under zero, and only lots of luck may save your tort from irreversible damage or death.

Please, give me those info!

 

[Terry Allan Hall]

And Fabian illustrates nicely why so many of us decline to risk our pet's health/lives when brumation is absolutely optional...it's not hard to make a tragic mistake, as many have found out too late.

OTOH, by getting your tortoise's enclosure back up to "summer conditions" (temperature/lightwise), your tortoise can happily live out the winter in perfect health as it waits for spring.

As keepers/stewarts for our pets, it's good to consider the whole picture.