2 female RTs living together

[bubbles1]

What is everyone's opinion on having more than one tort? I only have one and am thinking about getting a friend for her. She is a RT female and has a 4x2 ft indoor and big 8x20 ft outdoor enclosure. I know they are solitary creatures except for mating but I wanted everyone's opinion who have more than 1. Do they interact? Are they aggressive with each other? Do your torts seem happier having a friend? I also was wondering if instead of getting a Rt for her maybe something different like a Greek or Herman (not a Red foot or anything). Is that a bad idea to mix a RT with a Greek or Herman tort? Also, how do I introduce them? Do I just put the new tort in the current tort's ecnclosure? Will this upset my current tort? One more ?. When you purchase a tort from Turtle Source or Turtle Shack are you guaranteed thery don't have parasites? do you still need to take it to the vet for a parasite check?
So, here are my ?s:
1. Opinions, stories about having more than 1 tort.
2. Mixing Greeks or Hermans with a RT.
3. How to introduce the new tort to the current tort.
4. Where is the best place to get a captive bred tort that is reputable and parasite free?
Thanks!

 

[Yvonne G]

Russian tortoises are very aggressive breeders, so unless you want to raise them, I wouldn't get a male to go with your female. The males bite off the females' eyelids, bite chunks out of the females's legs...real aggressive.

I also am not a proponent of mixing species. I believe each specie requires its own habitat, set up specifically for that type of tortoise.

You always have to have a plan B when thinking of adding to your collection. If you get another tortoise and they don't get along, you'll have to set up a new habitat. So keep that in mind.

And remember to quarantine for at least 3 months.

 

[Stephanie Logan]

I've read too many unhappy endings on this forum to promote the idea of "companion tortoises."

My torty is too deformed to ever risk her breeding, and I wouldn't want to expose her to possible bullying or aggression from another tortoise, so I am very happy to treasure and spoil her rotten as an "only tort".

Still, a lot of keepers on this forum do succeed at keeping tortoise collections, but they have lots of space and separate enclosures at hand.

You should post some photos of your current RT for us to admire: http://tortoiseforum.org/thread-5245.html, or tinypic.com or flickr should help you out!

 

[Seiryu]

4. Where is the best place to get a captive bred tort that is reputable and parasite free?

I don't think there is a breeder anywhere that can guarantee their tortoise to have no parasites. If they are shipping across state lines they need a health certificate, but many do not do this. Even if they have it, there is no guarantee still that it has none.

Any time you get a new animal, whether it be a cat, dog, reptile etc you should take it to the vet as soon as you can after getting it.

So whoever you do decide to go with, you should take it to the vet, especially that you already have another tortoise.

 

[bubbles1]

Russian tortoises are very aggressive breeders, so unless you want to raise them, I wouldn't get a male to go with your female. The males bite off the females' eyelids, bite chunks out of the females's legs...real aggressive.

I also am not a proponent of mixing species. I believe each specie requires its own habitat, set up specifically for that type of tortoise.

You always have to have a plan B when thinking of adding to your collection. If you get another tortoise and they don't get along, you'll have to set up a new habitat. So keep that in mind.

And remember to quarantine for at least 3 months.

Thanks Yvonne! Yeah, I didn't want to mix a male with my female.
I mentioned Greek or Herman because I thought their care was very similiar to a RT. Thanks so much for your thoughts!

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I've read too many unhappy endings on this forum to promote the idea of "companion tortoises."

My torty is too deformed to ever risk her breeding, and I wouldn't want to expose her to possible bullying or aggression from another tortoise, so I am very happy to treasure and spoil her rotten as an "only tort".

Still, a lot of keepers on this forum do succeed at keeping tortoise collections, but they have lots of space and separate enclosures at hand.

You should post some photos of your current RT for us to admire: http://tortoiseforum.org/thread-5245.html, or tinypic.com or flickr should help you out!

Thanks Stephanie! I'd like to read some of the posts about companion torts. I am going to try and find these posts.

---

4. Where is the best place to get a captive bred tort that is reputable and parasite free?

I don't think there is a breeder anywhere that can guarantee their tortoise to have no parasites. If they are shipping across state lines they need a health certificate, but many do not do this. Even if they have it, there is no guarantee still that it has none.

Any time you get a new animal, whether it be a cat, dog, reptile etc you should take it to the vet as soon as you can after getting it.

So whoever you do decide to go with, you should take it to the vet, especially that you already have another tortoise.

Great advice about taking a new animal to the vet. Thanks Rob!

 

[tortoisenerd]

I bought a captive bred baby that was about 4 months old and in my first year with him he had both coccidia and pin worms! My vet says they get it from their mother. It is normal for a tort to have some level of parasites, you just don't want them to be out of hand. Its dangerous for the parasites to be in higher numbers as they weaken the immune system, for example if the tort got a respiratory infection on top of the parasites, it could be deadly when otherwise the tort might have been able to recover.

I would not add another tort to that enclosure--I would build a new larger enclosure for them both (if same species and after quarantine and no parasites), and keep the old enclosure for if they need to be separate. With keeping the same enclosure, especially the same size enclosure, the original tort could feel even more like its space is being encroached upon. When you add a tort to an enclosure, the space for the original animal is halved essentially.

I would only get a second tort is YOU want the tort. Your tort doesn't need a companion. Plan on an enclosure for each tort, and if they are the same species and otherwise healthy and compatible, best case they would live together. It takes a lot of space for any tort group to be happy, especially when mixing sexes. Most of the time to get a captive bred tort you are getting a hatchling--older is tougher but not impossible to find (easier when looking at adoptions). Getting captive bred is definitely the way to go in my opinion, even if you have to wait longer and pay more, because then you don't support the importing business. Even temperature-sexed hatchlings are no where near guaranteed to be that sex, so just because the breeder says one sex, you may have the other, so you have to plan for that. My supposed to be male tort is likely a female (got him at 4 months old)!

 

[bubbles1]

I bought a captive bred baby that was about 4 months old and in my first year with him he had both coccidia and pin worms! My vet says they get it from their mother. It is normal for a tort to have some level of parasites, you just don't want them to be out of hand. Its dangerous for the parasites to be in higher numbers as they weaken the immune system, for example if the tort got a respiratory infection on top of the parasites, it could be deadly when otherwise the tort might have been able to recover.

I would not add another tort to that enclosure--I would build a new larger enclosure for them both (if same species and after quarantine and no parasites), and keep the old enclosure for if they need to be separate. With keeping the same enclosure, especially the same size enclosure, the original tort could feel even more like its space is being encroached upon. When you add a tort to an enclosure, the space for the original animal is halved essentially.

I would only get a second tort is YOU want the tort. Your tort doesn't need a companion. Plan on an enclosure for each tort, and if they are the same species and otherwise healthy and compatible, best case they would live together. It takes a lot of space for any tort group to be happy, especially when mixing sexes. Most of the time to get a captive bred tort you are getting a hatchling--older is tougher but not impossible to find (easier when looking at adoptions). Getting captive bred is definitely the way to go in my opinion, even if you have to wait longer and pay more, because then you don't support the importing business. Even temperature-sexed hatchlings are no where near guaranteed to be that sex, so just because the breeder says one sex, you may have the other, so you have to plan for that. My supposed to be male tort is likely a female (got him at 4 months old)!

Thanks for pointing out that even captive breds can have parasites from their mother. I didn't know if mail order services sent any health quarantee or not. An initial visit to the vet seems very important now. Thanks!

 

[-ryan-]

I keep my four big female breeders together, and they never seem to have any trouble. They establish a hierarchy and live within their boundaries. I keep the male with them for about a week at a time each month for breeding. I used to keep the male with my females all of the time (when I only had 2-3 females at the time) and again, they establish a hierarchy and after a week or so of being together they adapted. Now that the male is separated from the females most of the time, I notice that he is a lot more aggressive when he does get placed back in with them. Being away from his girlfriends he must realize how much he actually misses them

Two females are generally not a problem together. You may notice some biting in the beginning or one asserting dominance over another, but usually this is just the tortoises establishing a hierarchy and investigating one another.

Keep in mind, if kept properly, female russians get much larger than males, so you would have difficulty keeping two in a 4'x2' indoor enclosure unless they are only in it sparingly.

 

[BuffsTorts]

I have a male/female pair.
Only been together for a few weeks.
First 3 or 4 days the female was the aggressor and kept bumping the male with her shell.
I have not seen any of that for at least 2 weeks now, so she has established her self king of the cage.

I quarantined for 3 months, and had a clean fecal done on delivery of the female(second russian) and then I did a fecal on BOTH before I put them together for meals for a week.
The way I have my cages set up, its actually 2 cages attached with a big opening.
I kept the wood pieces I removed to join the 2, so if need be, I can block it off, and lower the lights to get them both up to par as proper cages.
Doing it this way means I need a total of 6 lights, where 3 would probably work if it was just one big space.
Good luck

 

[bubbles1]

I keep my four big female breeders together, and they never seem to have any trouble. They establish a hierarchy and live within their boundaries. I keep the male with them for about a week at a time each month for breeding. I used to keep the male with my females all of the time (when I only had 2-3 females at the time) and again, they establish a hierarchy and after a week or so of being together they adapted. Now that the male is separated from the females most of the time, I notice that he is a lot more aggressive when he does get placed back in with them. Being away from his girlfriends he must realize how much he actually misses them

Two females are generally not a problem together. You may notice some biting in the beginning or one asserting dominance over another, but usually this is just the tortoises establishing a hierarchy and investigating one another.

Keep in mind, if kept properly, female russians get much larger than males, so you would have difficulty keeping two in a 4'x2' indoor enclosure unless they are only in it sparingly.

Thanks Ryan! Do your torts live different lives in the enclosure or do they do things together? If I had 2 females I would want them basically to both be awake most of the time, to be by each other or maybe follow each other sometimes. I'm trying to figure out if most torts interact or live different lives in their enclosures. Since I don't know anyone with torts and have only seen the 2 at the pet store once or twice I'm really not sure. I wish I could watch your torts interact.....Thanks!

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I have a male/female pair.
Only been together for a few weeks.
First 3 or 4 days the female was the aggressor and kept bumping the male with her shell.
I have not seen any of that for at least 2 weeks now, so she has established her self king of the cage.

I quarantined for 3 months, and had a clean fecal done on delivery of the female(second russian) and then I did a fecal on BOTH before I put them together for meals for a week.
The way I have my cages set up, its actually 2 cages attached with a big opening.
I kept the wood pieces I removed to join the 2, so if need be, I can block it off, and lower the lights to get them both up to par as proper cages.
Doing it this way means I need a total of 6 lights, where 3 would probably work if it was just one big space.
Good luck

I've read that alot of females are the aggressors on this forum. Interesting! You are an impressive tort owner! They are very lucky to have you! Thanks for the info on the multiple lights with a bigger enclosure. I also like how you can separate the two by inserting the wooden pieces. Very well thought out!

 

[elahmine]

I have two Rt. One male and one female. There has been no agression, and they aren't old enough to really be mating yet. They actually do cuddle with one another. They seem to enjoy each other's company, but I'd follow other people's advice and take percaustions.

 

[bubbles1]

I have two Rt. One male and one female. There has been no agression, and they aren't old enough to really be mating yet. They actually do cuddle with one another. They seem to enjoy each other's company, but I'd follow other people's advice and take percaustions.

Thanks for your sharing and your opinion! Does your young male carry his tail to the side? Does your young female carry her tail straight out? When do the torts' lengths start showing sex differences with how they carry their tails? Is it around 4 in. long or more when the torts are 5 or 6 inches long that they start to carry their tails either straight out or to the side? You said your torts aren't old enough yet so I'm figuring they are not real long yet. Are they showing tail preferences already? Thanks!

 

[-ryan-]

Sorry I haven't gotten back to you. I have been away from the computer for a while because of work and health issues. The best way I can explain the way my females interact is that they do their own thing, but often they instinctively are interested in doing some of the same things at the same time. For example, when I set the food tray in, at least two of the four will come running to it at the same time and eat together, but it's more or less just that they want the food at the same time. I find 2-4 of them basking 'together' underneath the heat lamps at almost any point in the day, but that's because they all seem to like the same heat lamp, and that is probably based on what that particular heat lamp offers rather than a desire to be near each other. They seem to act like siblings forced to share a room. They get along almost all of the time, utilize the same resources, and do interact with each other, but I bet there are times when they would like to get away from the other tortoises.

 

[elahmine]

I have two Rt. One male and one female. There has been no agression, and they aren't old enough to really be mating yet. They actually do cuddle with one another. They seem to enjoy each other's company, but I'd follow other people's advice and take percaustions.

Thanks for your sharing and your opinion! Does your young male carry his tail to the side? Does your young female carry her tail straight out? When do the torts' lengths start showing sex differences with how they carry their tails? Is it around 4 in. long or more when the torts are 5 or 6 inches long that they start to carry their tails either straight out or to the side? You said your torts aren't old enough yet so I'm figuring they are not real long yet. Are they showing tail preferences already? Thanks!

Well their about 2-3 inches. They're not exactly babies, but from my readings they have to be bigger to be sexually mature. The male carries his tail to the side. The femaile carries her's straight.

 

[bubbles1]

Sorry I haven't gotten back to you. I have been away from the computer for a while because of work and health issues. The best way I can explain the way my females interact is that they do their own thing, but often they instinctively are interested in doing some of the same things at the same time. For example, when I set the food tray in, at least two of the four will come running to it at the same time and eat together, but it's more or less just that they want the food at the same time. I find 2-4 of them basking 'together' underneath the heat lamps at almost any point in the day, but that's because they all seem to like the same heat lamp, and that is probably based on what that particular heat lamp offers rather than a desire to be near each other. They seem to act like siblings forced to share a room. They get along almost all of the time, utilize the same resources, and do interact with each other, but I bet there are times when they would like to get away from the other tortoises.

Thanks Ryan! I hope your health is okay. I loved how you described them as siblings who are forced to share a room! Very clever!

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I have two Rt. One male and one female. There has been no agression, and they aren't old enough to really be mating yet. They actually do cuddle with one another. They seem to enjoy each other's company, but I'd follow other people's advice and take percaustions.

Thanks for your sharing and your opinion! Does your young male carry his tail to the side? Does your young female carry her tail straight out? When do the torts' lengths start showing sex differences with how they carry their tails? Is it around 4 in. long or more when the torts are 5 or 6 inches long that they start to carry their tails either straight out or to the side? You said your torts aren't old enough yet so I'm figuring they are not real long yet. Are they showing tail preferences already? Thanks!

Well their about 2-3 inches. They're not exactly babies, but from my readings they have to be bigger to be sexually mature. The male carries his tail to the side. The femaile carries her's straight.

That's interesting and good to know that females and males start carrying their tails differently at only 2-3 inches. I thought it would be around 4-5 inches. Thanks!