I also have to go as I do have other pressing things to work on now that the holidays are over.
Those of you who have contributed thoughtful and thought-provoking input - many thanks.
Further updates on the lamp research will appear on the main Tortoise Trust website over the next couple of...
I already did. It was disbelieved.
They were raised in a polytunnel (18ft X 40 feet) with ambient humidity ranging from 40% to 60%. It would mostly be in the 50-55% range. No overhead heat lamps were used. Background heat was provided by multiple water-filled radiators powered by an...
With respect to sand and impaction.I have personally used it for over 20 years, many, many hundreds of tortoises - not one problem. It is also the case that many tortoises live on almost pure sand (though I do not normally recommend that in captivity). Testudo kleinmanni, some T. graeca, some T...
I just hope the majority of people are bright enough to see exactly what is going on here.
All these point blank denials that it is "impossible" to raise healthy smooth tortoises without resorting to entirely bizarre and extreme techniques, promoted by people who cannot even explain (or...
My own view is that there are often a number of things "off"...I could tell you one right away... think thermodynamics... radiant heat sources....thermoregulation cues.
What I really very sad and thoroughly, deeply depressing is just how far some keepers these days are absolutely and totally...
The Weisner and Iben paper - some thoughts
The paper by Wiesner and Iben has been uncritically cited numerous times and used frequently as key source material in discussions and reference texts related to the problem of so-called “pyramid growth†in tortoises. One of the most striking...
What I don't understand is why you can write all that and still refuse to address a couple of simple, straightforward, direct questions that have been put to you more than once...
A reminder (again):
I did earlier ask you some specific questions which you have totally ignored. Please...
Let me play Devil's Advocate here and raise a couple of practical questions.
1. It is certainly not the case that those tortoises in the wild are being subjected to 80%+ RH and constant high temperatures (+26C) around the clock and for 365 days a year. They get some wetter, more humid...
I have no desire to see this very useful thread deteriorate into a slanging match. I choose therefore not to respond to some of the comments made above.
I will simply state some facts, however.
1. Regarding my supposed "lack of experience" with leopard tortoises this needs addressing. The...
Let me repeat.
1. No-one is trying to "discredit" anyone. That's a truly bizarre and utterly baseless suggestion.
2. No-one is saying that humidity is not a factor.
3. What is being discussed are the links between assumed cause and effect, and the physiological mechanisms involved (the...
Can you be somewhat clearer on what you are asking for? Claims that protein has no effect? Claims that the cause is entirely humidity related? Or claims that the Weisner and Iben paper is credible and of importance?
Full details following. Judge for yourself.
Please refer back to earlier...
There has already been a much better controlled study. Worth a read.
It is important to highlight (yet again) another common misconception repeated in the article linked:
"After
more research I came across a book
that mentioned pyramiding of tortoise
shells. The book stated pyramiding was...
I would respectfully disagree with both statements above.
A perusal of various threads provides multiple examples.
As to the Weisner and Iben paper's importance in this, it is incontrovertible that this is indeed the prime source cited repeatedly as "scientific" support for the theory. This is...
I have zero interest in "discrediting" anything for the sake of it. I am rather more interested in weeding out facts from fiction, particularly when systems are being promoted to keepers that are based on deeply flawed research and defective hypothesis. The reason that this matters has been...
PS: Are you truly unaware of the fact that almost without a single exception all medicines in use today rely on data "extrapolated" from non-human animals at some stage in their development? Also that medicines veterinarians use to treat tortoises were not developed or tested on tortoises? But...
Some of us HAVE "tested it". Been there. Measured it....got the data.
I did earlier ask you some specific questions which you have totally ignored. Please answer them. I am sure if you can find time to attack the methodology of highly respected researchers like Justin Gerlach you can at least...
Interesting concept. While it undoubtedly removes one problem, I also have concerns it may be creating others. I have only done very limited testing with forced-air systems (back in 2009 when looking at vivaria and systems in stores and zoo exhibits), and have never looked at them in sufficient...
Justin's paper I think highlights very well the influence of diet on this matter. You cannot possibly ignore diet. It affects the integrity of the skeleton. It therefore has to have an important role. It would be absurd and irrational to claim otherwise.
The three key dietary factors are:
1)...
No problem. I understand the context of the question now.
I think there are a number of serious problems with that study. They say that their intent was to (I quote) "examine the effect of dietary protein level and environmental humidity on the degree of pyramidal growth in the carapaces". They...