Humid Hide substrate

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Redstrike

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Hello,
I've purchased two cherryhead redfoots, which will arrive tomorrow (YES!) and, after showing some pictures of my enclosure to the breeder, she did not recommend using sphagnum moss as a substrate within the hide areas. Apparently she's had bad luck with this, and I don't doubt her in the slightest (not the point of this thread).

I'm hoping some of you might have some suggestions for a good substrate to put in the hides for humidity and borrowing into??? The entire enclosure has a base of soil & peat moss (~60-30 mix, respectively) and is topped with a couple inches of cypress mulch.

Thoughts on a good hide substrate for 2 cherryheads (other than sphagnum moss)?

Thanks,
Chris
 

jeffbens0n

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I was going to suggest sphagnum moss I'm curious why she doesn't like it.

You could use some sort of soil/coco coir combination, or just coir, but that's gonna be much messier than the moss.
 

allegraf

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As the breeder that Chris is getting his hatchlings from, I am the one who does not like sphagnum moss. I have had deadly results with using it in humid hides and as substrate. I know that TerryO, Nerd and many other keeper use sphagnum with great success, but I am not one of them. I will always tell the people about my experience and opinions on using moss. I use only cypress mulch so I can easily determine and control the moisture levels in the substrate. The moss has a tendency to feel dry to the touch but can be moist underneath.

This discussion is a great example of why this forum is helpful. Keeping our torts healthy and happy is the most important thing for most of us. Different setups are also more appropriate for different areas in the world. For example, someone in Canada or England may need the extra moisture from moss to maintain humidity levels. Since I am in South Florida, I think the heat and ambient humidity breaks down the moss way too quick and causes more problems than it solves. I am a firm believer that every keeper has to find what works for them, their torts and their area. I know what works for my torts in South Florida and will always share my experiences, that is how we all learn. But I will stress, it is a constant learning process and there is no wrong way so long as your torts are healthy and happy. One thing I can suggest is that you can reach out to other keepers in your area of the world to find out what works for them. And now I will step down from my soapbox!

Allegra

PS
I don't think I'm doing too bad either, if I do say so myself!
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Madkins007

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I have used long-fibered sphagnum moss for a while and stopped. It was hard to keep it from getting too damp and it seemed like my torts got much worse plastron rot on it than they do on other substrates.

I'm curious why you are using two layers? That seems like a lot of trouble. For smaller indoor habitats, I just use a few inches of cypress (but I also use under-substrate heating cables for some heat and great humidity).

Red-foots like hides they can snuggle into. I use an angled chunk of real bark they can dig under. I just use cypress inside, but I have also used and like a fluffy mix of peat moss, soil, and sand.
 

Redstrike

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I've kicked the sphagnum to the curb! I'm sure it's fine for some, but as these are my first two cherryheads, I don't want to take any chances. I also realized that I had never checked the base soil layer for vermiculite so, that went too. They'll be stomping around on cypress only for now, if it works out, great! Thank you all for sharing your experiences, it's invaluable knowledge!

-Chris
 

Crazy1

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Chris, I probebly don't have to mention but will, that when you dampen your cypress make sure you check to the bottom of your enclosure. I had my enclosure slightly tipped and found in one corner it got pretty wet at the bottom, like a little puddle in that corner. Once I set it straight I just kept a close eye on it from bottom to top. I love cypress mulch just wish it was easier to get in larger amounts in So Calif. I have and do use the moss outside the hide on one side of the enclosure when my little one was inside.
 

jeffbens0n

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I have used cypress mulch in my humid hides as well when i was out of sphagnum, but it always seemed harder to keep moist. I also thought it wasn't as soft and comfortable for them to burrow into like the moss...but that is probably just me attaching my human emotions to my torts. Interesting to hear your point of view though Allegra.
 

Redstrike

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Crazy1 said:
Chris, I probebly don't have to mention but will, that when you dampen your cypress make sure you check to the bottom of your enclosure. I had my enclosure slightly tipped and found in one corner it got pretty wet at the bottom, like a little puddle in that corner. Once I set it straight I just kept a close eye on it from bottom to top. I love cypress mulch just wish it was easier to get in larger amounts in So Calif. I have and do use the moss outside the hide on one side of the enclosure when my little one was inside.

I have my enclosure lined with a 2x4 foot flood tray from the hydroponics store because I figured this might happen. It was a bit pricy ($60), but I think it will be worth the investment. I'll be sure to check the base periodically to avoid any serious water build-up.

Thanks Robyn,
Chris
 

terryo

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I don't use a hide for the smaller ones (turtles and tortoise). I put some plants and form a cave and then fill it with sig. moss from CarolinaPetSupply. I love their moss....very soft with no junk in it. I wet it with hot water, squeeze it out and fluff it up. It works very well for me. I don't keep my substrate wet. I only water the plants in their little pots and mist once a day...only the plants. The moss is very heavy in the cave so they have to dig their way into it.
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allegraf

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terryo said:
I don't use a hide for the smaller ones (turtles and tortoise). I put some plants and form a cave and then fill it with sig. moss from CarolinaPetSupply. I love their moss....very soft with no junk in it. I wet it with hot water, squeeze it out and fluff it up. It works very well for me. I don't keep my substrate wet. I only water the plants in their little pots and mist once a day...only the plants. The moss is very heavy in the cave so they have to dig their way into it.
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Chris,

You should ask TerryO about her set up, she is in your neck of the woods and would be able to tell you what works VERY well for her and her torts!

Allegra
 

Redstrike

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allegraf said:
terryo said:
I don't use a hide for the smaller ones (turtles and tortoise). I put some plants and form a cave and then fill it with sig. moss from CarolinaPetSupply. I love their moss....very soft with no junk in it. I wet it with hot water, squeeze it out and fluff it up. It works very well for me. I don't keep my substrate wet. I only water the plants in their little pots and mist once a day...only the plants. The moss is very heavy in the cave so they have to dig their way into it.
080-3.jpg


Chris,

You should ask TerryO about her set up, she is in your neck of the woods and would be able to tell you what works VERY well for her and her torts!

Allegra

Just sent her a PM. So far things are going well, though I'd like to have a bit more control over the humidity. I've kept it near 80%, but after about 2-3 hours it starts to drop to 65-70%, so it's taking repeat mistings, which will be impractical and not feasible in the future. Thinking I'll cover portions of the top with something impermeable (plexiglass/plastic...?) to help.
 
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