Red foot vet visit worms/parasites medication help

Emullennn

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Hello! New user, hoping to get some opinions from our vet visit.

Background - I've had my red footed tortoise for 5 years, he was adopted generally healthy but skinny from a qualified rescue when I was in college, and have since maintained his environment with a UVB light, ceramic heat lamp, humidifier, and a lettuce based diet with a handful of fruits and veggies on top. I tried every protein on the list, but he refuses all of them. He was a picky eater when I adopted him at 10 years old, so I've accepted his diet as is. He's had periods of lethargy but will wake to eat and it's been fixed with increased heat/humidity.

The point of my post - I wanted to double check what the vet I went to told me. I brought him in because he hadn't eaten in 2 weeks outside of the blueberries on top of his lettuce, and was much more lethargic than usual. The closest listed tortoise vet is over an hour away, so I went to vet that accepts "exotics." The summary of the vet visit was that he was diagnosed with worms and/or parasites from a fecal test ( I forget which, it was an overwhelming visit) and given metoclopramide injects x5 days to treat them. XRay showed no signs of pneumonia, but lots of food still in his digestive tract. His blood work showed, in summary, "some signs of inflammation" and I was told to keep an eye on his behavior. They're unsure if there's anything more going on such as tumors in his GI tract at this point and want to do a barium next visit. They also suggested a feeding tube, but I asked for 2 more weeks to try and convince him to eat first because I thought it was too quick to tube him.

My question, first and foremost, is ensuring that metoclopramide is an appropriate medication? Secondly, is there anything more I should be doing? I've been soaking him 2x day but he hasn't pooped in 2 days, is still only wanting to eat blueberries, and has not improved his alertness. I'm extremely worried and open to all advice.

Thanks so much!
 

Yvonne G

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I've never seen metoclopromide used to treat parasites. It is my understanding it is used to treat people who have problems with slow stomach emptying (reason I know this is because my sister has this problem and takes this medication). Normally tortoise parasites are treated with Panacur for the type of parasites you can see with the naked eye, and with Flagyl for the microscopic parasites.

See if your tortoise will eat a scrambled egg. I stir up an egg in a bowl then microwave it, let it cool then offer to the tortoise. You can crush up the shell and leave it in the egg. Recalcitrant greens eaters usually like red and green leaf lettuce, have you tried that? Since he's interested in blueberries, try blending them until juicy and mushy, then mix this in with chopped greens until all the greens are covered with the blueberry mush.

For getting them to poop: Using a tub big enough that he can't climb out of, add enough water to come up to the middle of his sides and position a light over the edge of the tub. Make sure there's plenty of room for him to get away from the light. Just leave him in there for an hour or so, longer is even better. Let him scramble around trying to get out. It's the scrambling that causes the digestive tract to let go. Be sure to keep an eye on him to make sure he doesn't end up on his back in the water. And do this in a warm room, that way the water temperature won't get any colder than the room temperature.

Good luck, and please keep us in the loop. We all learn from others' experiences.
 

Kapidolo Farms

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I would say your vet is exploring their ignorance at your expense. A contrast x-ray with barium to see if there is a gut tumor based on what? slow eating?

Yvonne's advice is good, you might also see if any grocery store in your area has edible flowers, fresh, or Hibiscus (called Jamaican) flowers for tea. Soak the dried flowers to make them soft, something about the scent/color sparks eating interest. Try mushrooms, try papaya, strong odor and bright color items.

As for worming, again see Yvonne's comment. BTW, you can buy Panacur at most feed and tack stores. The formulary (dose) is online with the MERCK index of drugs and their uses.

Your vet, at the very least should reach out to someone who knows better, and consult with them. Many 'real' exotic vets cross collaborate.
 

TammyJ

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I totally agree with Yvonne and Kapidolo Farms. They know what they are talking about! Please follow their advice, and please keep us posted on your little guy's progress (NOT with that vet, I hope!)

Have you given him long, warm soaks regularly? And can we see some pictures of him and his enclosure?
 

ZEROPILOT

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What has changed in that 5 years?
Any recent changes?
Your Redfoot needs to be 80 degrees to digest food. But temperatures above 90 make them uncomfortable. Is the cooler weather a factor?
Is he drinking?
Flowers, fruits such as Figs, tomatoes, mango, strawberries and banana....Things like mushrooms and boiled shrimp and chicken. Mazuri tortoise chow. But NOT THE L.S. VARIETY.
Redfoot can eat a vast assortment of foods. More so than any other species. And a well fed tortoise can usually deal with a parasite load. What do you have locally? See if he eats it.
I do not understand the injections.
Redfoot often have Roundworm. I would say that it's even common(?) Not every case needs to be treated. But as @Yvonne has said, oral treatment with PANACUR is effective and inexpensive.
I've treated two Redfoot in the past by placing the prescribed amount of paste into a slice of mango.
Even a VERY SICK Redfoot will eat mango.
If he's eating blueberries, he's going to eat other things. Find out what they are.
A diet high in sugars can be tolerated by Redfoot. It's a diet that would kill some other species. So if that's what he wants....Let him get his strength back by eating mostly fruit. Then we can wean him back off to a 40% fruit diet. But for now, let's just get food in him and do not do a feeding tube with a tortoise that DOES EAT.
Find another vet.
This one is learning on your animal.
 
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ZEROPILOT

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Can you take a few photos?
Take pictures of your enclosure. Your lighting and the animal itself.
Maybe we can suggest a few easy tweaks to help him right away.
I see you're in Connecticut. So I understand that he can't live outdoors.
That's a shame.
But it's not the end of the world.
@Yvonne G Do we have any known tortoise vets in Connecticut?
 

Emullennn

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Hi everyone, thank you all SO MUCH for your responses it’s so nice to hear from others.
I have been soaking him for the past almost two weeks daily (previously periodically as he has a large water dish he can sit in as he wants) in order for him to poop. He was pooping 4/6 days in t he water prior to the vet visit and not since, even when I’ve upped it to 2x a day. He has not pooped since the vet, I’m hoping this is a coincidence.
I had also already been blending finely cropped greens in with blueberries and cucumber to try and encourage him to eat, he does a good job of picking out the blueberry mush and some cukes, but I think I snuck a little bit of greens in there.
Thanks for confirming my concerns with the vet, my red flags went up when she didn’t even suggest soaking, and said that some use Timothy Hay as a substrate. I can’t imsgjne that would hold moisture for him without getting moldy and gross.
My understanding with his meds are hat he had a 1x dewormer at the vet and then the metoclopramide is to move his bowels along. So far, no poop. They also said intramuscular objects over subcutaneous, and I’m not sure why.
He’s still sleeping the day away, except I’m waking him up for walking around and soaks and he’s active then.
Also, it’s reassuring to hear that he could tolerate more sugar temporarily and that it’s not tube time yet. He does love mango, I’ll get him some and keep mixing some greens in.
I’m also going to call one of the CT vets listed here tomorrow and schedule his follow up with them instead.
I will post better pictures tomorrow and would love all advice! I use 2 tortoise tables together, and he’s currently in his own room where humidity is around 50 in the air with a room humidifier. Temperature is mid 70s, when I run a space heater it goes into 80s). His hide is enclosed, ceramic heater is above the close side to the hide and UVB light is on far side. When he’s feeling well, he walks around a lot, stopping in his water dish (under UVB light) and climbing the walls.
 

Emullennn

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Also, sorry for the long winded response! I’ve been using this site for my answers for 5 years and am under the most stress I’ve been in with him now.
Thanks for your help, all!

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ZEROPILOT

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You've got an obvious issue and that's your substrate, housing and humidity.
If you used the proper substrate. Orchid bark. And moistened it, your wooden box will rot.
You need to close off most of the top with something like plexiglass to keep in the humidity with that correct substrate.
But even with all of that I'm not sure that your main issue is there.
You want humidity of over 70%.
That's easy here in south Florida. It's a sauna outside.
In Connecticut that will be a bit more difficult. But closing off the top of an enclosure to create a closed chamber not only holds in humidity. It also holds in warmth and keeps out drafts.
His shell shows some pretty aggressive pyramiding due to lack of humidity.
That needs to be addressed.
But I'm not sure if the not eating is connected to that issue.
Feed him whatever he'll eat to get him strong again.
(Please, LORD. NO ONE read this post and feed anything but a Redfoot fruit!)
Get him eating and hopefully there will be a rapid improvement.
Warmth of at least 80, 82.
Humidity of over 70%
No excessive harsh lights.
No cold drafts.
Drink lots of water.
(That cucumber will soon cause runny poop and mild dehydration)
 
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daniellenc

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I think he’s too cold too which slows eating and elimination. Definitely hit up a Home Depot or Lowe’s and cover the open area with plexi glass. You can always mount radiant heat panels inside.
 

Yvonne G

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Yes, I agree that heat is an issue. The inside of the enclosure isn't warm enough. And being directly in front of a cold window doesn't help.
 

Ghazan

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Maybe you meant metronidazole (flagyl) which can be used for parasites, some of which won't be treated by Panacur. Metoclopramide (Reglan) is for nausea/vomiting/motility, maybe you got the two names mixed up?

Shoot for 85F room temp and >70-80% humidity
 

Lolovespark

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metoclopramide Also called reglan, helps move the digestive track along. I’m an NP, specifically a midwife and we use is for nausea and constipation in pregnant and postpartum pts. Maybe your tortie just needs to clean himself out. The warm bath is a good idea too! Good luck!!

 

ZEROPILOT

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Maybe you meant metronidazole (flagyl) which can be used for parasites, some of which won't be treated by Panacur. Metoclopramide (Reglan) is for nausea/vomiting/motility, maybe you got the two names mixed up?

Shoot for 85F room temp and >70-80% humidity
Knowing what to treat and with what treatment is why we need vets.
 

Kipley

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Some great advice here. I just adopted a 6.5 lb, 8 year old Redfoot with moderate pyramiding. I'll get some photos and start a thread on him. He has been kept on wood shavings, snake bedding? He came with a 20 inch by 48 inch table. His skin is so dry. But he is very active, seems happy, curious, not at all shy, and eats everything I offer. Going to utilize some of the suggestions here and will post a new thread with specific questions I have.
 

ZEROPILOT

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Some great advice here. I just adopted a 6.5 lb, 8 year old Redfoot with moderate pyramiding. I'll get some photos and start a thread on him. He has been kept on wood shavings, snake bedding? He came with a 20 inch by 48 inch table. His skin is so dry. But he is very active, seems happy, curious, not at all shy, and eats everything I offer. Going to utilize some of the suggestions here and will post a new thread with specific questions I have.
Get him on some nice, damp Orchid bark.
That pine bedding may just be the worst substrate that there is for your Redfoot. Hopefully you can get his pyramiding under control. Although the pyramiding is mostly just a cosmetic issue, it indicates a history of improper care.
It's good that you got him.....And that you've found this forum together.
 
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