White eyes

Master_Roshi · Apr 30, 2017

I had a sulcata hatchling for just a month and just got a leopard tortoise when I compared them I saw that my sulcata had white eyes I'm new so I didn't know with the sulcata alone, he's had them for at least a week now, I am not using a UV coil, what should I do?

Master_Roshi · Apr 30, 2017

Nevermind I'm not sure if this is a coil

Yvonne G · Apr 30, 2017

Yes, that's the dreaded coiled bulb we're always warning against. But are you talking about the skin above the eyes? This is white because the tortoise is too dry.

JoesMum · Apr 30, 2017

A good close up photo of the affected eyes will help us

Master_Roshi · Apr 30, 2017

Well after 2 weeks when I got the tortoise he started being lazy and didn't open his eyes fully

JoesMum · Apr 30, 2017

That doesn't look good. Turn off your UVB and leave it switched off. Your tort will be fine without UVB for a few days. Hopefully the eyes will improve quite rapidly.

Replace the bulb with a long fluorescent tube type UVB bulb and fitting.

If you would like us to check over your enclosure for any other potential causes then please post photos of it.

Have you read the TFO care guides? They're written by species experts working hard to correct the outdated information widely available on the internet and from pet stores and, sadly, from some breeders and vets too.

Beginner Mistakes
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/

How to raise a healthy Sulcata
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.79895/

For those that have a young Sulcata
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/for-those-who-have-a-young-sulcata.76744/

Master_Roshi · Apr 30, 2017

Thanks for the help, what do you think of the enclosure?

cmacusa3 · Apr 30, 2017

Master_Roshi said:
Thanks for the help, what do you think of the enclosure?

It's too open, you are losing all the needed heat and humidity and you shouldn't be mixing species

http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/closed-chambers.32333/

You need to read the above link and make some changes, torts aren't good in pairs and definitely not good to mix species and put them in pairs.

Even if they were the same species, you would want to quarantine them from being around each other for at least 6 months, you just put them together not knowing the cause of the sickness of the Sulcata, you don't know what is causing the eye issue and now it could be spread to the Leopard.

JoesMum · Apr 30, 2017

It is in need of some work. It is rather small and your Sulcata will very rapidly outgrow it. Your tort will weigh 100lb or more in a very few years; they grow fast.

If you read the healthy Sulcata thread I linked, you will see that your tort needs a warm humid environment to be healthy.

The mesh screen impedes the lights, particularly the UVB effectiveness, but also the basking heat. You need to have a solid lid on the enclosure that goes over or around the lights.

Those reptile bowls are a tipping hazard for a small tortoise and hard for it to use. A large piece of flat rock or slate makes a great food plate and helps keep your tort's beak in shape while it eats. You can also use the wrong side (not shiny) of wall tile for the bathroom or kitchen. For water, use a terracotta plant saucer and sink it intothe substrate so the rim is level with the surface. Surrounding the water dish with rocks he!ps to stop substrate being dragged in.

Read the links I gave you earlier and compare with what you have so you can plan your changes

Master_Roshi · Apr 30, 2017

Ok thank you I'll separate them

JoesMum · Apr 30, 2017

cmac3 said:
It's too open, you are losing all the needed heat and humidity and you shouldn't be mixing species

http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/closed-chambers.32333/

You need to read the above link and make some changes, torts aren't good in pairs and definitely not good to mix species and put them in pairs.

Even if they were the same species, you would want to quarantine them from being around each other for at least 6 months, you just put them together not knowing the cause of the sickness of the Sulcata, you don't know what is causing the eye issue and now it could be spread to the Leopard.

I hadn't noticed the second tortoise!

What species is that?

Tortoises are not social and don't want a friend. Sulcatas are among the worst bullies. All torts see other torts as rivals for food and space that to be told to leave. Your sulcata will undoubtedly win and the other tort could die. You will need to separate these permanently.

cmacusa3 · Apr 30, 2017

JoesMum said:
I hadn't noticed the second tortoise!

What species is that?

Tortoises are not social and don't want a friend. Sulcatas are among the worst bullies. All torts see other torts as rivals for food and space that to be told to leave. Your sulcata will undoubtedly win and the other tort could die. You will need to separate these permanently.

Leopard tort, it was mentioned in the first post.

JoesMum · Apr 30, 2017

cmac3 said:
Leopard tort, it was mentioned in the first post.

My phone app reading skills are faulty

At least care is similar. They still need to be separated though.

wellington · Apr 30, 2017

All good info given. Please follow it. Read the linked threads and make all the changes. Not sure if it was mentioned, but your UVB should not have screen of glass between it and the torts. You can also use a mercury vapor bulb for UVB, light and heat. Please follow the closed chamber threads and make one for each

Master_Roshi · Apr 30, 2017

Thanks so much for the advice guys I already separated them and I'm putting a lid on the container

Bee62 · Apr 30, 2017

Have I read that you use no UVB bulb ? All tortoises need UVB or they will get sick. Your young sulcata has no white eyes, her eyes are swollen and half closed. He looks very sick.
If you don`t keep your tort in warmth, humidity and with a UVB light it soon will die.
How did you keep your torts warm night and day ?

Master_Roshi · Apr 30, 2017

Bee62 he did have a uvb bulb and a heat bulb one for day and another for night, since the members recommended not to use the uvb coil I have, I guess I'll open a window for sunlight to go trough

Anthony P · Apr 30, 2017

Why do the tortoises need to be separated? These genre are from similar parts of the world and are similar enough genetically to actually hybridize in captivity. Whats more, is the fact that these two tortoise are both captive bred and do not harbor the same parasite load as the species that are more commonly imported.

I think there are major enclosure modifications that should be the focus of our discussion here. What are the temps inside different points inside the enclosure?

cmacusa3 · Apr 30, 2017

Anthony P said:
Why do the tortoises need to be separated? These genre are from similar parts of the world and are similar enough genetically to actually hybridize in captivity. Whats more, is the fact that these two tortoise are both captive bred and do not harbor the same parasite load as the species that are more commonly imported.

I think there are major enclosure modifications that should be the focus of our discussion here. What are the temps inside different points inside the enclosure?[/

Just for starters one is already sick and nobody knows the cause so why subject the other one to it. We could go on arguing these facts all day. Right now it's best for the owner to separate and get the housing set up right.

JoesMum · Apr 30, 2017

Anthony P said:
Why do the tortoises need to be separated? These genre are from similar parts of the world and are similar enough genetically to actually hybridize in captivity. Whats more, is the fact that these two tortoise are both captive bred and do not harbor the same parasite load as the species that are more commonly imported.

I think there are major enclosure modifications that should be the focus of our discussion here. What are the temps inside different points inside the enclosure?

Both species are solitary. Both will defend their territory from others and try to get the other to leave. Neither species wants company or gets lonely.

Bullying can be mental and/or physical. Sulcatas in particular fight nasty and can draw blood.

The sulcata is likely to be the dominant tortoise as it the more aggressive and will grow quicker.

The Leopard will be harassed, is likely to withdraw, become sick and could ultimately die.

In the wild, these torts can avoid each other. In a small indoor enclosure there is no chance of this happening.

We also don't recommend species being mixed as the "germs" tolerated by one could kill the other.

Two relevant threads:

Why not to keep 2 torts together - a lesson learned the hard way (about Russians, but they're aggressively territorial too)
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/thread...together-a-lesson-learned-the-hard-way.94114/

Pairs (written by @Tom who's a species expert on Leopards and Sulcatas)
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/pairs.34837/

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