TORTOISE STRESS. ARE THEY REALLY THAT FRAGILE

[wellington]

I read comments on various threads all the time about this or that may be stressing your tortoise.
What are your thoughts about it! Are they really that fragile?
I personally think not. I'm not fragile with my torts. I do what I need to do for them and I don't tip toe around them. When I pick them up, i just grab them, I don't support their legs. Sometimes I carry them side ways. When/if they flip over, I just flip them back. When I put them down, I just put them down. If I want to carry more then one at a time, I put two in a bag, used to do three in a bag. Sometimes I can't reach them to pick them up, so I grab under their shell and drag them over to me. I have never seen a single sign of stress. They don't stay tucked into their shells. They don't stop eating. They don't stay hidden in their hides. They act as normal as I know their normal to be. Like a tortoise. Oh, and I have not had one sick or die.
If they could be so easily stressed. Would they be able to survive as long as they have and do!
What's your opionion?

 

[Rue]

That's a very good question, and I have been wondering the same thing.

I get the impression, from what I've read, that we are 'supposed' to tip-toe around them. However, mine, at least, doesn't give me the impression I need to tip-toe around her.

I'm very interested to see what everyone else has to say.

 

[G-stars]

I believe the stress most tortoises are affected by is mental rather than physical.

The chronic stress of being bullied by another tortoise, without the chance to escape is one example. It weakens their immune system.

 

[wellington]

I believe the stress most tortoises are affected by is mental rather than physical.

The chronic stress of being bullied by another tortoise, without the chance to escape is one example. It weakens their immune system.

Yes, I agree with tortoise/tortoise stress. That's not what I am asking about. Its the human/tortoise stress.

 

[wellington]

I read comments on various threads all the time about this or that may be stressing your tortoise.
What are your thoughts about it! Are they really that fragile?
I personally think not. I'm not fragile with my torts. I do what I need to do for them and I don't tip toe around them. When I pick them up, i just grab them, I don't support their legs. Sometimes I carry them side ways. When/if they flip over, I just flip them back. When I put them down, I just put them down. If I want to carry more then one at a time, I put two in a bag, used to do three in a bag. Sometimes I can't reach them to pick them up, so I grab under their shell and drag them over to me. I have never seen a single sign of stress. They don't stay tucked into their shells. They don't stop eating. They don't stay hidden in their hides. They act as normal as I know their normal to be. Like a tortoise. Oh, and I have not had one sick or die.
If they could be so easily stressed. Would they be able to survive as long as they have and do!
What's your opionion?

Let me say, I am not talking about tortoise/tortoise stress. That I agree with. I as agree you can see it. Actually all the things I said my torts don't do cause of my handling, is what a tortoise under stress from another tort would do.
Again, I am not talking about tortoise on tortoise stress!

 

[G-stars]

Yes, I agree with tortoise/tortoise stress. That's not what I am asking about. Its the human/tortoise stress.

I have never noticed any of my tortoises be stressed by human contact or presence. Some are a little more shy/cautious especially at a younger age. But that's normal. It's instinct kicks in to be fearful of large mammals.

 

[Gillian M]

I never noticed any stress on OLI until he began to flip on his back.

 

[Rue]

What about the suggested stress of moving them around?

We move them from their indoor enclosure => to their outdoor enclosure => to their bath => to other places, and the consensus seems to be that that is fine.

But if we move them anywhere else - all of the sudden it's a huge stressor and we shouldn't do it.

If they are used to being moved around to different places (and yes, most of those different places might be quite familiar to them in their own right i.e. indoor versus outdoor enclosure) - and they are habituated to being moved by their caretakers - why is one such move considered to be acceptable and the next one not?

...and again, I'm not talking about moving them to an unfamiliar location on a regular basis for no reason.

Another example is shipping. Apparently it's okay to submit them to the stress of shipping by mail - but not okay to stress them by taking them to a new home in the car.

I am not following the logic.

 

[JoesMum]

Shipping by mail does stress a tortoise. We have many newly shipped arrivals on here that take a long time to come round.

I can only go by personal experience of car journeys and say that Joe loathes them. He poops prolifically, constantly tries to escape and ends up in a right state afterwards. Fortunately we haven't had to do them with him often. If we do, I make sure he's cold so it causes him as little stress as possible.

 

[WithLisa]

In my opinion they are quite fragile, I had torts that stopped to eat and died because of stress. I guess a healthy tortoise can easily tolerate some raw handling every now and then, but for example a change of enclosure can affect them a lot.

My torts do show signs of stress when I pick them up, they struggle and urinate. They are still small and I don't want them to dehydrate, so I handle them as little as possible.

 

[wellington]

In my opinion they are quite fragile, I had torts that stopped to eat and died because of stress. I guess a healthy tortoise can easily tolerate some raw handling every now and then, but for example a change of enclosure can affect them a lot.

My torts do show signs of stress when I pick them up, they struggle and urinate. They are still small and I don't want them to dehydrate, so I handle them as little as possible.

How do you know they stopped eating and died because of stress? I doubt it was stress. Most likely already ill. An ill tortoise will not be able to handle the same things as one that is in good health. They can't be too fragile, they have survived for decades.

 

[Tony the tank]

I don't think they are stressed as much as we think...I don't coddle any of my big boys...some I can no longer pickup.. So when I give them a quick check.. I flip them over to see there underside...some times for 2-3 minutes to give them a good scrub if they need it...I then just flip them back over and give them a apple which they woof right down...They all have heated hides in the winter month..But sometimes I come out at sunrise to find one of my Sulcatas sleeping under a bush..(45* outside) No ill effect....My Russians are gathered up and all placed in a Rubbermaid sweater box were they climb all over each other.... I weigh them.. Mark them and place them back in the pen were they go right back to grazing ...In 10yrs of keeping tortoises I have never lost one.... But to be completely truthful I always leave any new animal alone for a month or two...to let them come into there own... Before I start handling them...

 

[wellington]

The different levels of "stress" a tort can handle may also have something to do with specie differences and/or the environment it is being kept in. I've had a few torts shipped and when their box was opened, there were no signs of stress. They were ready to come out and join the world. Maybe it has to do with the stress level of the human? Hmmm, if everything stresses you out, then you assume everything is stressing your tort out too.

 

[WithLisa]

How do you know they stopped eating and died because of stress? I doubt it was stress. Most likely already ill. An ill tortoise will not be able to handle the same things as one that is in good health. They can't be too fragile, they have survived for decades.

Who knows, but they were doing fine before in their outside enclosure and once they were moved into a small inside enclosure they stopped eating, climbing the walls and trying to escape almost 24/7. Blood test, faecal samples, x-ray,... were all negative.

 

[juli11]

Yes I agree. CB are normally not really difficult with stress especially testudo for example. But there are also some species which produce really shy CB animals which are delicate for stress..
WC animals are all the time delicate for stress especially in the first month after the import. The problem here is that if they have stress their tummy doesn't really work because kinds of worm and bacteriums can breed faster and start to destroy the gastroenteritis system. That's the reason why many of the imports need some time before they start eating. Hopefully everybody understand what I mean

 

[juli11]

I also think that a outdoor enclosure is also very helpful for the animals to become not so stressful.
An example:
I keep since 3 years kinixys spekii and kinixys lobatsiana. Both of them are WC animals. In the summer i keep only the spekii in a outdoor enclosure the lobatsiana live the whole time inside. What i see is that the spekii in the outdoor enclosure lost their whole shyness, I can feed them from my hand and they start laying eggs.
The opposite by the lobatsiana.
These points which I named by spekii are a 100% confirmation that outdoor enclosure are helpful.

 

[ALDABRAMAN]

Istressing your tortoise // What's your opinion?

~ We truly believe that tortoises easily stress and make every reasonable effort to avoid and at least minimize any unnecessary stress possible.

 

[wellington]

~ We truly believe that tortoises easily stress and make every reasonable effort to avoid and at least minimize any unnecessary stress possible.

Do you feel this about your adults more then your babies or the other way around or both just as easily stressed as the other? Of course we only see pictures, but a lot that we have seen being done, no one seems stressed

 

[leigti]

I think a lot of it depends on the species and how close we can get there man-made environment to what they Live in in nature. And I think a healthy tortoise is not fragile. I have done just about all the things you mentioned sometimes gentle just doesn't cut it, tonight I had to bring the tortoises in because it's going to get enough low 40s. If anybody has tried to drag out a Russian or pancake tortoise when they have dug in for the night then you know what I am talking about.
But I think a sick tortoise is fragile and can be more stressed by the actions of the humans. And it can be very difficult to turn them around. I have lost one and it was heartbreaking. And I think young members of any species are more fragile.

 

[JoesMum]

On this forum, we hear about so many torts of all species that stop eating and/or hide away when all that's happened is that they have moved to a new enclosure which may or may not be with a new owner.

They do get used to a new home, some take longer than others, and I am sure they get used to the particular way their human handles them.

Where they have both indoor and outdoor enclosures, for example, they will be used to being moved between the two. They get used to being fished out for a soak as well.

All animals are capable of being stressed. Torts are no exception. Some individuals are more easily stressed than others - nothing new there.

Surely though, this is simply about doing what you can to ensure that any animal (or human for that matter) in our care isn't unnecessarily stressed by our actions?

It's not a whim. It's common sense.