1. Welcome! Are you interested in tortoises? If so, we invite you to join our community! Our community is the #1 place for tortoise keepers to talk online. Once you join you'll be able to post messages, upload pictures of your tortoise and enclosure, and discuss any tortoise topic with other tortoise keepers. Get started today!

Offense Taken by New Member

Discussion in 'Introductions' started by Ben Cane, Jan 10, 2017.

  1. Ben Cane

    Ben Cane New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2017
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    I am a keeper of various animals all shapes and sizes, but my two six month old sulcata's are my latest editions.. I've used other forums before and there's always someone who has nothing better to do than insult my intelligence or try to start an arguement so let me start off by saying, this is a simple question and please stick to the topic..

    I've had my two boys (or so I've been told there boys) for a good 2 months now and they've settled in nicely.. both eat, drink and poop (a lot) and I've been monitoring there sizes and weights. and Darwin, the larger of the two seen on the right of my avatar, has been gaining weight a lot faster than Oogway (named after character from Kung Foo panda).. and I've noticed Oogway is more inclined to dig holes in his substrate than Darwin, the growth difference and behaviour patterns leads me to think maybe Oogway is female? I know it's near impossible to tell at this age but would anyone else be of the opinion that it's possible that he/she is displaying female behaviours? Or do some sulcata simply like to dig more than others?
    Gillian Moore and Killerrookie like this.
  2. Grandpa Turtle 144

    Grandpa Turtle 144 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2013
    Messages:
    8,597
    Likes Received:
    6,096
    Trophy Points:
    113
    (These ads do not appear for registered members.)
    Hello Ben
    ImageUploadedByTortoise Forum1484060542.682618.jpg
    Killerrookie likes this.
  3. Tidgy's Dad

    Tidgy's Dad Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2015
    Messages:
    35,282
    Likes Received:
    80,728
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Fes, Morocco
    Hello, Ben, and a very warm welcome to Tortoise Forum to you,Darwin and Oogway.
    Tortoises do grow at different rates , even when from the same clutch and brought up in identical conditions. Genetic, i guess, just like people.
    At six months it is too early to be certain of their sex, so one could indeed be a female (or even both! )
    It is also possibly bullying. Tortoises should never be kept in pairs, groups can work with enough space, but pairs almost never. Subtle bullying like huddling together or one eating more food than the other is often hard to spot, but these tortoises need to be separated, i'm afraid. It is possible one is bullying and dominating the other and interfering in its normal growth by eating the lion's share and making the other one too nervous to eat as much as it should.
  4. cmac3

    cmac3 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2014
    Messages:
    2,953
    Likes Received:
    3,326
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tulsa, Oklahoma
    I couldn't agree with this more, these animals are way to young to tell and the digging has nothing to do with male or female.
  5. Killerrookie

    Killerrookie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2014
    Messages:
    2,000
    Likes Received:
    2,940
    Trophy Points:
    113
    By that size you'll see your sulcatas throwing dirt around all the time. It's part of their behavior! Like Adam said it's to early to tell if it's a male or female till the tortoise gets bigger. Most sulcatas love to dig no matter if it's a female or male.
    cmac3 and Tidgy's Dad like this.
  6. Ben Cane

    Ben Cane New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2017
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    There in the same enclosure for now but I have a 3 acre plot of land attatched to my house and intend to move them outside on a permanent basis as soon as there of age, I've seen two 70 year old males living in a 10x10 metre enclosure and they got along absolutely fine and had done so for 7 decades so I'm not concerned with bullying at all.. some animals get along and others don't, same as people, genetics I guess.. anyway the one doing all the digging is actually the smaller of the two despite being the one I see eating and hogging all the food.. in any case, as I said, please stick to topic because one comment and I'm already frustrated by it.. would you be of the opinion the smaller one could be female as it is more inclined to dig holes..?
    Killerrookie likes this.
  7. cmac3

    cmac3 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2014
    Messages:
    2,953
    Likes Received:
    3,326
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tulsa, Oklahoma
    No it has nothing to do with male or female. They all dig. I might add though the small one could be digging to get away from the large one
    PJay, Ben Cane and Killerrookie like this.
  8. Ben Cane

    Ben Cane New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2017
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Il take that as a no then anyway and il finish by adding, if I wanted an opinion on wether two tortoises could be kept together, that would have been my question wouldn't it?
    Killerrookie likes this.
  9. Ben Cane

    Ben Cane New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2017
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    There from the same clutch and it's always in a particular corner, both take turns in digging the hole but one certainly seems to do more work, hence why I asked..
    Killerrookie likes this.
  10. Tidgy's Dad

    Tidgy's Dad Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2015
    Messages:
    35,282
    Likes Received:
    80,728
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Fes, Morocco
    Not necessarily.
    People often don't know that keeping two together is a bad idea, so wouldn't ask the question as it wouldn't occur to them.
    As it is a possible factor in the size difference it is correct to point it out in a reply.
  11. Killerrookie

    Killerrookie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2014
    Messages:
    2,000
    Likes Received:
    2,940
    Trophy Points:
    113
    If you're sure you want to keep these guys together I recommend getting them their own food bowls and water dishes so one doesn't hog everything and cause the other to stress. Most people on the forums just don't like a pair living in the same confined space.
    Anyways back to the question. There's literally not much of a way to tell if it's female or male yet till it's grown to a size that we can tell it's gender. The tortoise is just digging and it's just a natural behavior most sulcatas have.
  12. cmac3

    cmac3 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2014
    Messages:
    2,953
    Likes Received:
    3,326
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tulsa, Oklahoma
    I understand, their finicky little creatures, so there's really no telling what could be going on. Just keep a good eye on things.
    PJay, Ben Cane and Killerrookie like this.
  13. Tom

    Tom The Dog Trainer 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2010
    Messages:
    36,571
    Likes Received:
    12,611
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Southern California
    I've raised hundreds of baby sulcatas and I've never noticed the behavioral differences you describe having anything to do with the sex of the animal.
    PJay, Ben Cane and Killerrookie like this.
  14. BILBO-03

    BILBO-03 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2016
    Messages:
    627
    Likes Received:
    365
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I would say the bigger one Is bullying the smaller one so he's trying to hide and he's stressed so he's not going weight. You need to house them separately tortoises don't do good in pairs sometimes trios work but now always. So get the separated and make sure they have 80+ humidity for them to grow smooth because they look kinda bumpy from your avatar picture.
  15. wellington

    wellington Well-Known Member Moderator 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2011
    Messages:
    31,023
    Likes Received:
    7,709
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois, USA
    More likely bullying or one likes to dig more then the other. I would caution the bullying part. Tortoise do not do good in pairs. Specially sulcatas. This may be why your seeing a size difference too and the digging could be it is trying to get away from the bully
  16. Ben Cane

    Ben Cane New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2017
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    I'm an animal lover aswell as a keeper, so in an instance where I saw one head butting the other or trying to tip the other over of course I would react as necessary.. but they don't, they quite happily eat bath and sleep and even poop together so I wouldn't put it down to personal space.. the corner in question is under the combi lamp and I did wonder if maybe they were too warm, but I've taken ambient and surface temperature readings and all is within the norm so to be honest I'm stumped by it. The shape of the smaller ones shell is more flat and slopes toward the rear unlike the larger one who is very round and domed.. almost like a ball..
  17. wellington

    wellington Well-Known Member Moderator 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2011
    Messages:
    31,023
    Likes Received:
    7,709
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Chicago, Illinois, USA
    Also, if you want the best advice, this is the place to get it from. We have many members with years of experience and we have all the latest info for raising smooth healthy tortoises. If your getting your information from other places, your probably getting wrong info. Like, tortoises when small specially, need a high humidity to grow smooth, not pyramided. Yes, that includes sulcatas. Check out the caresheets.
    Killerrookie and Tidgy's Dad like this.
  18. Ben Cane

    Ben Cane New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2017
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    This is what annoys me on these forums. That picture was taken 2 months ago the day after I brought them home so any pyramiding of which there is none, wouldn't be down to my ability to care for them.. there bathed every 2 days and they love it, they have a humid hide and are fed well on only fresh, supplemented, foraged food.. I don't do tortoise mix as the prolonged effects are still unclear to me. The small one follows the large one around and there always sat together, never apart or on separate sides of the table so personal space is not a concern to me. I won't use this forum again
  19. Yvonne G

    Yvonne G Old Timer TFO Admin 5 Year Member Platinum Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2008
    Messages:
    66,684
    Media:
    13
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    23,065
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Clovis, CA
    Hi Ben, and welcome to the Forum!

    Since tortoises are solitary animals, they don't appreciate having other tortoises come into their territory. Having two tortoises contained in a small space is a recipe for trouble. The more aggressive animal will try to get the more passive animal to leave the territory. You don't always see this as fighting. It expresses itself as both of them trying to sleep in the same spot (that's not cuddling), or one stays hiding all the time, or one grows bigger than the other.

    To answer your question, some sulcatas burrow, some don't. I've had my 110lb sulcata, Dudley, for many years now, and he has never offered to dig a burrow, being completely satisfied resting under the bush or in his shed. I've taken in rescue sulcatas that start digging a burrow before the day is out. It's not a male/female thing. It's just a personal preference.
  20. Ben Cane

    Ben Cane New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2017
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Someone delete my account because I can't find an option anywhere to do so
Similar Threads: Offense Taken
Forum Title Date
Introductions Badly taken care of Feb 18, 2012

Share This Page