Not Walking!!!

Angi_Clyde

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First of all hi everyone I’m new here . I have 2 sulcata tortoises Angi and Clyde they are about 8-10 months old. They had pyramiding along with dehydration. I then changed their enclosure, lights and substrate and I started giving them calcium powder and I even put a humidifier. The point is their enclosure is not a problem anymore .

What is concerning me rn is that they don’t walk properly, they drag themselves and do not lift their bodies up . I asked a friend who said they might have something called perplexing I guess. If anyone knows what is this please help me stop it or prevent it .

Ps , I read the care sheet
 

Melis

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Welcome!

We will need more detailed info such as what kind of lights you use, how often you add calcium, what the temps and humidity is, how large the enclosure is, etc. pics of the torts and enclosure would be helpful too.

"Perplexing" is a word we use in the US to mean "confusing".

Is it their front or back legs that are dragging? Both are doing the same thing? Possible metabolic bone disease?
 

Yvonne G

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Sounds like what Melis said - metabolic bone disease. The tortoise eats a calcium rich diet, then sits in the sun to absorb the UVB rays, which turn to vitamin d3 inside the tortoise's body. The vitamin d3 works with the calcium to make the bones and shell strong. The tortoise MUST have those two things - calcium AND vitamin d3 (UVB). So, an indoor tortoise has to have a good UVB light in order for the calcium to make the bones strong. What kind of light are you using?

I had an Aldabran tortoise that had a calcium deficiency, and he dragged his body, seemingly having no strength in his legs to lift himself off the ground. It took intensive calcium/UVB therapy to get him stronger.
 

TechnoCheese

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Hello, I was the friend they were talking to.
They do have a uvb light, and they use calcium powder. The shell isn’t soft at all, besides being a bit playable on the plastron.
I’m almost wondering if they might be constipated, and she just told me that they’d been pooping less.
 

Tom

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First of all hi everyone I’m new here . I have 2 sulcata tortoises Angi and Clyde they are about 8-10 months old. They had pyramiding along with dehydration. I then changed their enclosure, lights and substrate and I started giving them calcium powder and I even put a humidifier. The point is their enclosure is not a problem anymore .

What is concerning me rn is that they don’t walk properly, they drag themselves and do not lift their bodies up . I asked a friend who said they might have something called perplexing I guess. If anyone knows what is this please help me stop it or prevent it .

Ps , I read the care sheet
How long have you had them, and what was their early care like? Any UV? Access to sunshine? What were you feeding them? Do they live as a pair in the same enclosure? How often were they soaked? What do they weigh now?
 

Yvonne G

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Usually if there were stones or constipation, the back legs would be more or less paralyzed. I got the impression that the legs work but they're not strong enough to pick up the tortoise.
 

TechnoCheese

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Usually if there were stones or constipation, the back legs would be more or less paralyzed. I got the impression that the legs work but they're not strong enough to pick up the tortoise.

Yes, you are correct. I just talked to her a while longer, and it turns out that their uvb light is a coil and it’s too high up. I’d say MBD now.
 

Angi_Clyde

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Welcome!

We will need more detailed info such as what kind of lights you use, how often you add calcium, what the temps and humidity is, how large the enclosure is, etc. pics of the torts and enclosure would be helpful too.

"Perplexing" is a word we use in the US to mean "confusing".

Is it their front or back legs that are dragging? Both are doing the same thing? Possible metabolic bone disease?

Back legs , yes both started walking this way at the same time .
 

Angi_Clyde

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How long have you had them, and what was their early care like? Any UV? Access to sunshine? What were you feeding them? Do they live as a pair in the same enclosure? How often were they soaked? What do they weigh now?

I had them for 7 and half months , It wasn’t good at first and now I use UVB and ceramic heat emitter.
No access to sunshine since it’s so hot here. Yeah they live as a pair put I’m gonna separate them soon also I don’t see them harming each other.
I soak them once a week or once every two weeks .

One of them is 166g and the other is 131g
 

Melis

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Please post pics of your enclosure so we can try to help you.
They need to be soaked daily. What is the humidity of their enclosure?
Even though you don't see them physically harming each other, it could be happening. Only one of them can get the best foods, or the best spot to warm up, etc. One will be dominant to the other.
 

Tom

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I had them for 7 and half months , It wasn’t good at first and now I use UVB and ceramic heat emitter.
No access to sunshine since it’s so hot here. Yeah they live as a pair put I’m gonna separate them soon also I don’t see them harming each other.
I soak them once a week or once every two weeks .

One of them is 166g and the other is 131g
Based on what I'm reading, I think they have metabolic bone disease. They need some access to sunshine every day, and they should be soaked at least once a day. Their enclosure should be partly in the shade but allow them access to sun. Try sunning earlier in the day before things get too hot. Do be very careful, as small ones can over heat quite easily. As long as it is less than 36-37 in the shady part of their enclosure, you should be fine. You can use mister, sprinklers and you humidifier to keep things cooler in the outdoor enclosure. Most summer days are 37+ here where I live too, and I have no problem sunning mine daily. On the days when its 43+ C, I just leave them inside, or sun them earlier in the morning. I also use sprinklers and misters during the mid day heat.

You could also experiment with digging them and underground retreat to escape the heat of the day. This is what they do in the wild and it suits them perfectly. Be aware that they may be afraid to use their "burrow" for a week or two. Just keep putting them in there to show them there are no tortoise eating monsters in the hide.
 

Angi_Clyde

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Please post pics of your enclosure so we can try to help you.
They need to be soaked daily. What is the humidity of their enclosure?
Even though you don't see them physically harming each other, it could be happening. Only one of them can get the best foods, or the best spot to warm up, etc. One will be dominant to the other.


IMG_6992.jpg

I’m building a new one soon , I also changed the substrate to coco husks, humidity is usually 60% to 80%
 

Angi_Clyde

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Based on what I'm reading, I think they have metabolic bone disease. They need some access to sunshine every day, and they should be soaked at least once a day. Their enclosure should be partly in the shade but allow them access to sun. Try sunning earlier in the day before things get too hot. Do be very careful, as small ones can over heat quite easily. As long as it is less than 36-37 in the shady part of their enclosure, you should be fine. You can use mister, sprinklers and you humidifier to keep things cooler in the outdoor enclosure. Most summer days are 37+ here where I live too, and I have no problem sunning mine daily. On the days when its 43+ C, I just leave them inside, or sun them earlier in the morning. I also use sprinklers and misters during the mid day heat.

You could also experiment with digging them and underground retreat to escape the heat of the day. This is what they do in the wild and it suits them perfectly. Be aware that they may be afraid to use their "burrow" for a week or two. Just keep putting them in there to show them there are no tortoise eating monsters in the hide.

I soaked them today and I’ll try to soak them everyday , I keep them in an indoor enclosure but I’ll manage to take them out when it’s not too hot.
 

Taylor T.

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View attachment 233619

I’m building a new one soon , I also changed the substrate to coco husks, humidity is usually 60% to 80%
Okay, there are certainly a few things you should change.

Firstly, that UVB bulb is not a good source of UVB and can cause eye issues in tortoises, especially young ones. Replace it with a long tube type florescent UVB bulb.

That lettuce you are feeding them is not a good food to be a large part of their diet. Here is a list of better thing to feed them:
Mulberry leaves
Grape vine leaves
Hibiscus leaves
African hibiscus leaves
Blue hibiscus leaves
Rose of Sharon leaves
Rose leaves
Geraniums
Gazanias
Lavatera
Pansies
Petunias
Hostas
Honeysuckle
Cape honeysuckle
Leaves and blooms from any squash plant, like pumpkin, cucumber, summer squash, etc...
Young spineless opuntia cactus pads

Weeds:
There are soooooooo many...
Dandelion
Mallow
Filaree
Smooth Sow thistle
Prickly Sow thistle
Milk thistle
Goat head weed
Cats ear
Nettles
Trefoil
Wild onion
Wild mustard
Wild Garlic
Clovers
Broadleaf plantain
Narrow leaf plantain
Chick weed
Hawksbit
Hensbit
Hawksbeard

Other good stuff:
"Testudo Seed Mix" from http://www.tortoisesupply.com/SeedMixes
Pasture mixes or other seeds from http://www.groworganic.com/seeds.html
Homegrown alfalfa
Mazuri Tortoise Chow
ZooMed Grassland Tortoise Food

Variety is key here. You want to feed them as many different types of food as possible.

If you are already building a new enclosure, it would be good to make two. a 4'x8' enclosure each would last them a while. You need to get them out of that enclosure they are in now ASAP as it is much to small for one tortoise, let alone two. Without proper space to walk, they cannot digest their food properly.

Humidity should never go below 80% while they are still growing. You really should be soaking them daily in lukewarm water for 30 minutes.
 

Melis

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509
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I soaked them today and I’ll try to soak them everyday , I keep them in an indoor enclosure but I’ll manage to take them out when it’s not too hot.
I don't want to alarm you, because I know you are trying to do better. But please understand that if your torts are suffering from MBD, all these changes that have been suggested to you must be completed now. They need UV. They need to be soaked. They need to be separated into bigger enclosures with high humidity. A humidifier is not the solution. Sulcatas are pretty hardy so there is still a chance for your little guys. But these changes need to be made now.
 

Angi_Clyde

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Messages
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Location (City and/or State)
Dubai
Okay, there are certainly a few things you should change.

Firstly, that UVB bulb is not a good source of UVB and can cause eye issues in tortoises, especially young ones. Replace it with a long tube type florescent UVB bulb.

That lettuce you are feeding them is not a good food to be a large part of their diet. Here is a list of better thing to feed them:
Mulberry leaves
Grape vine leaves
Hibiscus leaves
African hibiscus leaves
Blue hibiscus leaves
Rose of Sharon leaves
Rose leaves
Geraniums
Gazanias
Lavatera
Pansies
Petunias
Hostas
Honeysuckle
Cape honeysuckle
Leaves and blooms from any squash plant, like pumpkin, cucumber, summer squash, etc...
Young spineless opuntia cactus pads

Weeds:
There are soooooooo many...
Dandelion
Mallow
Filaree
Smooth Sow thistle
Prickly Sow thistle
Milk thistle
Goat head weed
Cats ear
Nettles
Trefoil
Wild onion
Wild mustard
Wild Garlic
Clovers
Broadleaf plantain
Narrow leaf plantain
Chick weed
Hawksbit
Hensbit
Hawksbeard

Other good stuff:
"Testudo Seed Mix" from http://www.tortoisesupply.com/SeedMixes
Pasture mixes or other seeds from http://www.groworganic.com/seeds.html
Homegrown alfalfa
Mazuri Tortoise Chow
ZooMed Grassland Tortoise Food

Variety is key here. You want to feed them as many different types of food as possible.

If you are already building a new enclosure, it would be good to make two. a 4'x8' enclosure each would last them a while. You need to get them out of that enclosure they are in now ASAP as it is much to small for one tortoise, let alone two. Without proper space to walk, they cannot digest their food properly.

Humidity should never go below 80% while they are still growing. You really should be soaking them daily in lukewarm water for 30 minutes.

I soaked them and where I live it’s really hard to get this food, but don’t worry I already ordered tortoise seed mix to plant
 

Angi_Clyde

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Messages
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Dubai
I don't want to alarm you, because I know you are trying to do better. But please understand that if your torts are suffering from MBD, all these changes that have been suggested to you must be completed now. They need UV. They need to be soaked. They need to be separated into bigger enclosures with high humidity. A humidifier is not the solution. Sulcatas are pretty hardy so there is still a chance for your little guys. But these changes need to be made now.

I’m working on the new enclosure, and I want you to know that I’m trying so hard to provide all these things because it’s really hard here to get your hands on a reptile supplies especially tortoise.
 

Angi_Clyde

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Dubai
Tomorrow our spring break will start I’ll try to make them walk a lot every morning when it’s not too hot .
 
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