Normal growth? Help me :(

thegame2388

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Its always amazing to me how fast they can grow. When they are little we count every gram. Then, within a few months, as they gain size we begin counting by the hundreds of grams, and then by pounds.

So unbelievable that a little 35 gram baby will grow up to be a 55,000 gram monster in such a short time.

Nothing much to update. He's at 12588g (27.75lbs).

I do have a question: Currently in Southern California, like Tom, the temperature reaches somewhere between 100F-110F. Currently, inside his night box, its 102F....but the tortoise does not come out!

My question is: At what temperature would you force the tortoise to come out for his own health? Would you just leave him be (since he's got the option of coming out if he wanted)? Or would you see a health risk and pick him up and bring him out?

Also, our night time temps are between 50-65F. Sometimes he doesn't walk back to his own night box and just hangs out outside and sleeps, should I bring him in or leave him be (next day's highs are in the 100s anyway).
 

Oxalis

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Nothing much to update. He's at 12588g (27.75lbs).

I do have a question: Currently in Southern California, like Tom, the temperature reaches somewhere between 100F-110F. Currently, inside his night box, its 102F....but the tortoise does not come out!

My question is: At what temperature would you force the tortoise to come out for his own health? Would you just leave him be (since he's got the option of coming out if he wanted)? Or would you see a health risk and pick him up and bring him out?

Also, our night time temps are between 50-65F. Sometimes he doesn't walk back to his own night box and just hangs out outside and sleeps, should I bring him in or leave him be (next day's highs are in the 100s anyway).
I have a different situation, living in Michigan with a Russian who's mainly in his indoor enclosure. Every once and a while I pull him out of his night burrow and "remind" him that he needs to warm up under his heat lamp in the morning. I think it's OK to move him in and out of his night box; mine seems to have learned from this what he needs to do. Maybe he will understand after a while? Remember that you're looking out for his best interests, and he may not necessarily know where the best place to find shelter for the night is, for example.
 

teresaf

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Nothing much to update. He's at 12588g (27.75lbs).

I do have a question: Currently in Southern California, like Tom, the temperature reaches somewhere between 100F-110F. Currently, inside his night box, its 102F....but the tortoise does not come out!

My question is: At what temperature would you force the tortoise to come out for his own health? Would you just leave him be (since he's got the option of coming out if he wanted)? Or would you see a health risk and pick him up and bring him out?

Also, our night time temps are between 50-65F. Sometimes he doesn't walk back to his own night box and just hangs out outside and sleeps, should I bring him in or leave him be (next day's highs are in the 100s anyway).

Putting him in his night box at night is also good to keep him safe from nocturnal predators....
 

thegame2388

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I have a different situation, living in Michigan with a Russian who's mainly in his indoor enclosure. Every once and a while I pull him out of his night burrow and "remind" him that he needs to warm up under his heat lamp in the morning. I think it's OK to move him in and out of his night box; mine seems to have learned from this what he needs to do. Maybe he will understand after a while? Remember that you're looking out for his best interests, and he may not necessarily know where the best place to find shelter for the night is, for example.


Hmmm he knows how to leave and enter. I just worry when it gets 100F+ inside his night box during 11am ish and he still isn't out. I just forced him out at 4pm. It was 108F inside.
 

teresaf

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Hmmm he knows how to leave and enter. I just worry when it gets 100F+ inside his night box during 11am ish and he still isn't out. I just forced him out at 4pm. It was 108F inside.
Can you move his box under a tree? If sun doesn't directly shine on box it should stay cooler. Perhaps a tarp or something mounted over it(not ON it, just above it)
 
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Tom

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Nothing much to update. He's at 12588g (27.75lbs).

I do have a question: Currently in Southern California, like Tom, the temperature reaches somewhere between 100F-110F. Currently, inside his night box, its 102F....but the tortoise does not come out!

My question is: At what temperature would you force the tortoise to come out for his own health? Would you just leave him be (since he's got the option of coming out if he wanted)? Or would you see a health risk and pick him up and bring him out?

Also, our night time temps are between 50-65F. Sometimes he doesn't walk back to his own night box and just hangs out outside and sleeps, should I bring him in or leave him be (next day's highs are in the 100s anyway).

This year I painted the tops of their boxes white and that is keeping things much cooler. I also starting sprinkling the area down there. I run the sprinkler for 5 minutes two or three times a day and it keeps things much cooler too. That box is in full sun from about 9am until 7 pm every day. When the ambient temp is 105, the box stays 91. It used to get up to 110.

About moving him out: A clear answer doesn't jump out at me. In some situations I would scoot the tortoise's butt out and make sure all was good. In other cases I might jus leave the tortoise in and not worry about it. Many variables would determine which way I'd go.

About moving him in at night: I would move him in every night. I don't like them getting too cold at night. 65 probably won't hurt them with 100+ days every day, but dropping into the 50's… I worry. I unplug my night boxes in summer here and they drop to the low 70's on one of our 55 degree summer nights. Then they usually heat up into the 90s during the day. Since our night temps are so unpredictable and frequently drop into the 50s, I just don't feel comfortable leaving them outside, not to mention leaving them exposed to rats, raccoons, coyotes, etc...
 

thegame2388

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This year I painted the tops of their boxes white and that is keeping things much cooler. I also starting sprinkling the area down there. I run the sprinkler for 5 minutes two or three times a day and it keeps things much cooler too. That box is in full sun from about 9am until 7 pm every day. When the ambient temp is 105, the box stays 91. It used to get up to 110.

About moving him out: A clear answer doesn't jump out at me. In some situations I would scoot the tortoise's butt out and make sure all was good. In other cases I might jus leave the tortoise in and not worry about it. Many variables would determine which way I'd go.

About moving him in at night: I would move him in every night. I don't like them getting too cold at night. 65 probably won't hurt them with 100+ days every day, but dropping into the 50's… I worry. I unplug my night boxes in summer here and they drop to the low 70's on one of our 55 degree summer nights. Then they usually heat up into the 90s during the day. Since our night temps are so unpredictable and frequently drop into the 50s, I just don't feel comfortable leaving them outside, not to mention leaving them exposed to rats, raccoons, coyotes, etc...

For me, I know the night temps will not harm them. I am worried, however, about when the tort stays inside their box when its 110F at the ground temperature (at the level of their substrate). Knowing this, I don't mind leaving him outside hiding somewhere, sleeping, knowing he'll be all warmed up.
 

Tom

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For me, I know the night temps will not harm them. I am worried, however, about when the tort stays inside their box when its 110F at the ground temperature (at the level of their substrate). Knowing this, I don't mind leaving him outside hiding somewhere, sleeping, knowing he'll be all warmed up.

How do you know night temps in the 50s won't harm them?
 

Markw84

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Hmmm he knows how to leave and enter. I just worry when it gets 100F+ inside his night box during 11am ish and he still isn't out. I just forced him out at 4pm. It was 108F inside.
I would worry about temps that high. A core body temp of over 104° will kill a tortoise. I would never let a tortoise stay in a night box heated over that temperature. They do have a limited ability to cool themselves by watering eyes and extra salivation combined with "panting" by pumping their throat and legs. Using that technique they keep their body temp lower than ambient temps and can apparently survive limited exposure to temps over 115° but I would never test that! I'm not sure at all that they would "know enough" to move out of a hide on their own because it is too hot. The hide (their burrow) is their built in mechanism of where to go when its too hot. They are already where they "think" they should go.

I would paint the top white as Tom suggests. I also use sprinklers that wet my enclosures every 2 hours through the hotter parts of day - 11, 1, 3, 5. That keeps the enclosure cooler plus keeps the areas under the plants a lot cooler as well. If my enclosures got above 100°, I would block them and not allow the tortoise in.
 

Dizisdalife

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I would worry about temps that high. A core body temp of over 104° will kill a tortoise. I would never let a tortoise stay in a night box heated over that temperature. They do have a limited ability to cool themselves by watering eyes and extra salivation combined with "panting" by pumping their throat and legs. Using that technique they keep their body temp lower than ambient temps and can apparently survive limited exposure to temps over 115° but I would never test that! I'm not sure at all that they would "know enough" to move out of a hide on their own because it is too hot. The hide (their burrow) is their built in mechanism of where to go when its too hot. They are already where they "think" they should go.

I would paint the top white as Tom suggests. I also use sprinklers that wet my enclosures every 2 hours through the hotter parts of day - 11, 1, 3, 5. That keeps the enclosure cooler plus keeps the areas under the plants a lot cooler as well. If my enclosures got above 100°, I would block them and not allow the tortoise in.

If you block them out of their night box where do they go to sleep? Would you do this if the night time temps are, say 50°F?
 

Markw84

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If you block them out of their night box where do they go to sleep? Would you do this if the night time temps are, say 50°F?
I only would block them if (as @thegame2388 is experiencing) the temps inside a night box was above 100° to avoid overheating. Once the temps drop below, open it up for nighttime retreat.

I would not let a tortoise stay out, nor a night box get, below 65° over night. and then only when summer time daytime temps are high. When daytime temps are 70s° and below, I keep my nightbox at 75° plus a basking light during daylight hours.
 

thegame2388

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How do you know night temps in the 50s won't harm them?

I don't. Just speculation. During the summer time, generally speaking, I am more concerned about extreme heat than moderate cold.
 

thegame2388

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I would worry about temps that high. A core body temp of over 104° will kill a tortoise. I would never let a tortoise stay in a night box heated over that temperature. They do have a limited ability to cool themselves by watering eyes and extra salivation combined with "panting" by pumping their throat and legs. Using that technique they keep their body temp lower than ambient temps and can apparently survive limited exposure to temps over 115° but I would never test that! I'm not sure at all that they would "know enough" to move out of a hide on their own because it is too hot. The hide (their burrow) is their built in mechanism of where to go when its too hot. They are already where they "think" they should go.

I would paint the top white as Tom suggests. I also use sprinklers that wet my enclosures every 2 hours through the hotter parts of day - 11, 1, 3, 5. That keeps the enclosure cooler plus keeps the areas under the plants a lot cooler as well. If my enclosures got above 100°, I would block them and not allow the tortoise in.

I just don't get why he won't come out on his own, when it's that high. I can't cool the enclosure myself. The door is open, but it's under direct sunlight which is nice during winter time but not so nice when its summer.
 

thegame2388

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I only would block them if (as @thegame2388 is experiencing) the temps inside a night box was above 100° to avoid overheating. Once the temps drop below, open it up for nighttime retreat.

I would not let a tortoise stay out, nor a night box get, below 65° over night. and then only when summer time daytime temps are high. When daytime temps are 70s° and below, I keep my nightbox at 75° plus a basking light during daylight hours.

As for leaving him be over night outside, he likes to sleep behind our BBQ and in a corner of our backyard which is a bit cute. I am partly okay with this because I know he's safe, and I know the next day's high temp will be over 100F so he'll get plenty of sun and heat.
 

Markw84

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I just don't get why he won't come out on his own, when it's that high. I can't cool the enclosure myself. The door is open, but it's under direct sunlight which is nice during winter time but not so nice when its summer.
what is a tortoise "programmed" to do by instinct when it gets hot? Go into its burrow. If it gets hotter? Go deeper and dig up and find some moist dirt. Definitely not go outside!
 

thegame2388

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what is a tortoise "programmed" to do by instinct when it gets hot? Go into its burrow. If it gets hotter? Go deeper and dig up and find some moist dirt. Definitely not go outside!

Hmm true but there's only so much dirt/substrate in there.
 

Dizisdalife

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I only would block them if (as @thegame2388 is experiencing) the temps inside a night box was above 100° to avoid overheating. Once the temps drop below, open it up for nighttime retreat.

I would not let a tortoise stay out, nor a night box get, below 65° over night. and then only when summer time daytime temps are high. When daytime temps are 70s° and below, I keep my nightbox at 75° plus a basking light during daylight hours.
Thanks for the clarification. The climate here is a bit milder than your's or Tom's, but we do have days that seem uncomfortably warm, even for a tortoise.
 

Tom

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Hmm true but there's only so much dirt/substrate in there.
He's explaining what a wild tortoise would do in excessive heat, that your tortoise cannot do in your box.

Tortoises don't use reason and logic as we do. They use instinct. Our night boxes serve as their "burrows" in the tortoise's mind. It is where they go to escape temperature extremes. When its too hot topside, their instinct tells them to get in their burrow. Too hot in their burrow? Dig down deeper, which they can't do in an above ground box. Leaving the safety of the burrow and going back out into the sun when its too hot goes against their instinct.

You can cool your box to suitable temperatures. Paint the top white, and run a sprinkler all over it for 2-5 minutes a few times a day. They even have battery operated sprinkler controls that you hook up to your hose bib now. Screw the controller to the hose bib, screw the hose with a sprinkler on the end to the controller, and your done. Couldn't be any easier.

I use this type of sprinkler:
https://www.lowes.com/pd/Yardsmith-900-sq-ft-Spray-Sled-Lawn-Sprinkler/50328315

Here are a couple of timer options, but look at your local hardware store for more:
https://www.lowes.com/pd/Orbit-Digital-Hose-Water-Timer/50329571
https://www.1000bulbs.com/product/173698/GROW-HGWT.html?gclid=COjwn_Pg8tQCFYZefgodG9QMkg

You can hand water it if you are around at the right time of day.
 

thegame2388

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Currently its about 85F. The low tonight is around 66F....if that. I think he'll be fine.
 

thegame2388

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Hey guys, I am a little worried right now. I just checked my tort's weight and it's 12,054g. That's a 98g drop from May 2017 (3 months ago!) and a 534g drop from July 2nd. Should this be a normal weight drop during the summer time? Could it be his poop?

I don't want to assume it's some sort of worm or anything, and I doubt it is, but I just find it odd that he's actually LOST weight.

Any tips?

20170903_124001.jpg
 

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