New tortoise, need advice

[Jamie Wickens]

My wife and I have spoken for years about getting a tortoise, but between the price of them skyrocketing and the confusing info about hibernation, we decided not to get one.
A week or so ago, my mother was contacted by an old friend who said that they could no longer look offer their tortoise and if she would like it. She said that myself and my wife had always wanted a tortoise and so took it as a present to us.
She asked general questions about the tortoise, "Barry Allen" but couldn't get much info as he has had several homes. They think he is male, about 3 years old, they don't know what breed he is, and that he has a mark on his shell from a dog attack.
They were keeping him in a rabbit hutch in the shed, and havery said that he has never hibernated.
So I was just hoping for some info from actual tortoise owners as info on the Internet constantly contradicts itself. We live in the uk, where Temp go from 25c in summer to 0c in winter, does barry need to hibernate? If so, what are the best measures to do this? As I've seen people saying that tortoises don't hibernate, that they hibernate on their own, and that you have to put them in the refridgerator for several months :S

Any help is appreciated guys, thanks

 

[JoesMum]

Hello and welcome from Kent UK. We've had our tort for 46 years.

My wife and I have spoken for years about getting a tortoise, but between the price of them skyrocketing and the confusing info about hibernation, we decided not to get one.
A week or so ago, my mother was contacted by an old friend who said that they could no longer look offer their tortoise and if she would like it. She said that myself and my wife had always wanted a tortoise and so took it as a present to us.
She asked general questions about the tortoise, "Barry Allen" but couldn't get much info as he has had several homes. They think he is male, about 3 years old, they don't know what breed he is, and that he has a mark on his shell from a dog attack.

At 3 years old, he's unlikely to be able to be sexed accurately. He may be a she

They were keeping him in a rabbit hutch in the shed, and havery said that he has never hibernated.

A rabbit hutch isn't suitable accommodation, but I'll say more later.

So I was just hoping for some info from actual tortoise owners as info on the Internet constantly contradicts itself. We live in the uk, where Temp go from 25c in summer to 0c in winter, does barry need to hibernate? If so, what are the best measures to do this? As I've seen people saying that tortoises don't hibernate, that they hibernate on their own, and that you have to put them in the refridgerator for several months :S

Any help is appreciated guys, thanks

Here goes!

Barry doesn't have to hibernate at all. Depending on his species he may not be able to hibernate anyway. We need to see a picture of Barry - both his shell and plastron (undershell) to identify him before offering advice.

In the meantime, I recommend reading this
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/

 

[Jamie Wickens]

Hey, thanks for your fast reply, I gave your link a read, and sone very usefull info in there, definitely things I would've done if I hadn't read it so thank you.

Barry isn't in the rabbit hutch anymore, he is currently in a cat carrier with the top off. I know it is far too small, but I am in the process of making him a habitat that is 3ft long, 2ft wide and 1.5ft deep, with 1ft of the length covered for shade, (should be done by tomorrow.

I have one picture of him, but it's a bad picture, and of his front I'll get more tomorrow for you.

 

[Jamie Wickens]

Just in case the previous picture didn't work

 

[Lyn W]

Hi Jamie and welcome.
You may want to add a few more feet to that enclosure torts are wandering animals and like to roam about. The height should be fine it's floor space they need.
The Enclosures thread has some great ideas to help your plan.
Don't leave him in that cat carrier too long he could become stressed which could make him ill. A large underbed storage box would be better as a temporary measure to give him some space.
You'll also need a source of uvb such as a mercury vapour bulb (mvb) which gives heat light and uvb in one bulb to help his digestion and absorbtion of essential minerals etc. but it will be too hot to use in the cat carrier. I use an Arcadia D3 mvb from Pets at Home (about £40ish) with a wide dome ceramic holder (£25 at the Range) Don't buy the coiled bulbs pets shops sell as they can damage torts eyes. Check here before buying things from pet shops as people here can save you a lot of money!

 

[Jamie Wickens]

We currently don't have any bulbs set up, as the one my mum gave me is an edison screw, and every light in my house is a bayonet fitting, is there anything I can use in the mean time?

 

[Yvonne G]

Welcome to the forum, Jamie!

We call that tortoise "russian" but in the UK you usually refer to them as Horsefields tortoise.

 

[Jamie Wickens]

Hey Yvonne, thank you, do they need to hibernate?

 

[Yvonne G]

The Russian tortoise is a species that hibernates, but he doesn't "need" to. If you want to keep him up during the winter, you have to provide him with a fairly large indoor habitat with lights and heat.

 

[Jamie Wickens]

How large would "large" be as we live in a very small cottage with a dog and a 1yr old

 

[Yvonne G]

Well, then, you're really not going to like my answer.

Russian tortoises are hard wired to wander over great distances in search of food. When we contain them in a small indoor habitat, they get pretty stressed, trying to climb the walls, scratching in the corners, trying to dig their way out. We usually recommend 4x8', but you can make him comfortable in a large plastic tote about 1.5 x 4'. Try to find the Christmas Tree Storage bin manufactured by Iris. It's a good size for an indoor habitat.

http://www.nwaonline.com/news/2015/jan/10/decluttering-home-after-holiday-easy-wi/?print

 

[Jamie Wickens]

We should be able to find something to suit until I can build him a bigger enclosure. Quick question, we have no bulb or anything set up for him yet, and our house is currently very cold. Will he be alright tonight?

 

[RussianTortKing]

He should be fine tonight it's a problem when it's been a couple of weeks. Try to get your bulb this week and he will be fine.

 

[RussianTortKing]

Also, they're great at managing this kind of stuff as long as you have a need or bedding deep enough for them to burrow in. What's your substrate?

 

[Jamie Wickens]

That's good to hear, at the minuse it is artificial grass with soil and straw

 

[Jamie Wickens]

And that's what he was kept in before

 

[JoesMum]

Hi Jamie

I'm awake now

We have an ID of a Russian. I am going to post a lot of links and text. Sorry, but you need to read these as they're written by species experts who have taken the time to publish their knowledge and they save the rest of us time!

You have the Beginner Mistakes link, but here it is again
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/

Russian Tortoise Care
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/russian-tortoise-care-sheet.80698/

Russians are very active tortoises that both dig and climb requiring a minimum of 4' x 8' (1.5 x 2 metres) space. An old bookcase with the shelves knocked out, lined with a pond liner or shower curtain, makes a great tortoise table. Shop bought ones are not big enough.

The 'table' needs 3-4 inches (7-10cm) depth of substrate that can hold moisture to raise humidity... coco coir or orchid bark are popular. Humidity needs are explained in the above links. It's important the substrate has no added fertilisers or white bits (vermiculite, stones, calcium, etc) as this encourages the tort to eat it which isn't good for it.

Hay goes mouldy when damp and is not suitable.

Lighting and diet I'll explain in subsequent posts.

 

[JoesMum]

Here's a lighting summary:

Your tort needs:

1. A basking lamp
This must hang vertically, not at an angle. Basking is essential to raise your tortoise's core temperature so it can digest food.

2. UVB light
Read the instructions for the source to see how close to the substrate it must be. UVB is essential so your tort can process dietary calcium and have healthy bones and shell.

Both 1 and 2 are available from the sun for those able to live outside.

UVB does not pass through glass or perspex(plexiglass) - light must be direct to be effective not through a window. Mesh screening can also interfere with UVB.

3. A minimum overnight temperature (see the care sheet for your species) and complete darkness at night to sleep.


Notes

(a) A Mercury Vapor Bulb (MVB) provides combined UVB and Basking. Alternatively you can use 2 bulbs: a tube UVB and a reflector bulb for basking (a household reflector - not low energy or halogen - from a hardware store will do the job; it's the wattage that counts)

(b) Ignore any references to UVA you may read - it's misleading marketing speak.

(c) Compact coil UVB harms tortoise eyes and must not be used.

(d) Basking and UVB should be on a timer so the light(s) are on for 12 hours a day. Temperature under the basking is regulated by its height above the substrate.

(e) Overnight, depending on your home, you may need additional heat. You get this from a CHE (Ceramic Heat Emitter) which must be on a thermostat.

(f) Torts have outstanding colour vision and love red and purple food. Coloured heat lamps colour tank decor and torts don't always apply intelligence to what they eat, resulting them in eating tank decor. Coloured bulbs should not be used.


Measurements

There are 4 important temperatures that you must know for an indoor enclosure.
- Directly under the basking lamp
- Warm side
- Cool side
- Overnight Minimum

You will need digital thermometers for accuracy.

A temperature gun thermometer (inexpensive from Amazon) measures temperature accurately in specific places like directly under the basking lamp.

A min/max thermometer so you know the min/max temperatures in your home by day and night.

You should also get a good digital probe hygrometer to measure humidity.

Thermometers and hygrometer that stick to the side of the enclosure tend to be less accurate.

 

[JoesMum]

Your tort's diet is leafy greens preferably picked outdoors from a chemical fertiliser and pesticide free area rather than from a supermarket.

Pet shop reptile bowls are not suitable for tortoises - they're a tipping hazard. A piece of flat rock or slate makes a great food plate and eating off it helps to stop the beak overgrowing.

Feed your tortoise first thing in the morning and let him eat as much as he wants. If he eats it all, give him more. A mound of food roughly the size of his shell is a good starting point, though he won't eat much until the heat is sorted out.

In the months when greens are harder to come by, a good quality pellet supplement like Komodo is used by many. You will see Mazuri mentioned a lot on this forum; we can't buy it in the UK.

Your tort cannot digest sugars properly - they cause digestive and kidney problems - so fruit, tomato, peppers and carrot should only be fed very sparingly and very occasionally. They don't have to be fed at all. Banana is too sugary and must not be fed.

A tiny sprinkle of calcium powder should be added to food 3 times a week. A cuttlebone (found in the bird section of pet shops) left in the enclosure also helps with calcium intake.

Here's a list of suitable greens written by someone else... a few are not available in the UK, but most are.

Look them up on The Tortoise Table Plant Database if you're not sure what they look like.
http://thetortoisetable.org.uk/site/plant_database_14.asp

Mulberry leaves
Grape vine leaves
Hibiscus leaves
African hibiscus leaves
Blue hibiscus leaves
Rose of Sharon leaves
Rose leaves
Geraniums
Gazanias
Lavatera
Pansies
Petunias
Hostas
Honeysuckle
Cape honeysuckle
Leaves and blooms from any squash plant, like pumpkin, cucumber, summer squash, etc...
Young spineless opuntia cactus pads

Weeds:
There are soooooooo many...
Dandelion
Mallow
Filaree
Smooth Sow thistle
Prickly Sow thistle
Milk thistle
Goat head weed
Cats ear
Nettles
Trefoil
Wild onion
Wild mustard
Wild Garlic
Clovers
Broadleaf plantain
Narrow leaf plantain
Chick weed
Hawksbit
Hensbit
Hawksbeard

 

[JoesMum]

Now for water!

Outdated care keeps tortoises far too dry, hence hay and desert conditions.

The substrate should be kept damp by tipping water in and mixing it so it is evenly damp, but not wet.

Again, don't use a reptile bowl ... even a ramped one... for water. A terracotta plant saucer makes a much safer and more accessible water bowl in the enclosure.

Your tortoise should be soaked daily for at least 30 minutes for the time being as it is likely that he is dehydrated.

This is most successful first thing in the morning before he's warmed up properly. Use a high sided, flat-bottomed bowl that he can't see over or through. The water should be warm, not hot... think baby bath... and come just up over the line between the shell and plastron.

If he poops in it then scoop it out with your hand. If he pees in the water ignore it. If the water goes cold then change it.

Pee and poop colour varies with diet. For example, dandelions turn pee pink! White jelly-like pee is called urate and is normal; it's how your tort excretes excess proteins. If the urate becomes grainy then it's a sign of dehydration.