Hatchling Hermann's Rubbing Eyes

Abby043

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Apr 22, 2017
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Hi there, my name is Abby and I am new to the forum but I have used it as my main resource as a new tortoise owner. I have a four-month-old Hermann's hatchling named Otis, and I have had him for almost a month. He has a very large appetite, is soaked once a day for 15-20 minutes, and is fairly active in the morning and in the evening. He lives in a 50-gallon Rubbermaid tote with coco coir as the substrate with sphagnum moss in his hides. We have a hide on the warm side and cool side for him to choose from. There is a 10.0 UVB fluorescent bulb mounted about a foot above the substrate. We used a 65W incandescent bulb for heat and a CHE for the night time. We do not have AC, so the temperatures are high enough with the 65W for now, but I plan on picking up a higher wattage when it cools down. The basking area stays between 90 and 100 degrees, the ambient temperature between 80 and 85 degrees, while the cool side is in the high 70's. I spray daily with water and try to keep the humidity between 50% and 80%. He has gained 3 grams since we got him.

Today, he slept most of the day and around four, I gave him a soak and fresh food. Otis wasn't very interested in the food and he was acting strange. I noticed that he was sort of twitching his left eye and rubbing both eyes. He was also rubbing his face along the side of the enclosure a few times. After a few minutes, he went back to sleep in his hide. One thing out of the ordinary that I noticed a few days ago was a tiny white bug crawling on his shell/head, but thought maybe it was a springtail after doing some research here on the forum. That day and the days following, he acted completely normal.

I am not sure if there are more of those bugs and that is what is bothering him or if it is something else. Is there anything that I should be doing differently? What can I do to help my little guy?

Thank you!
 

Kasia

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Is your UV a coil bulb? Did you check his eyes?
Is it possible that some substrate got in them? If yes flush both eyes with a saline solution. Maybe there is something stuck in there. And probably it's not the bugs. Is you substrate moist or is it a bit dusty in some areas?
 

Abby043

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Apr 22, 2017
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Is you UV a coil bulb? Did you check his eyes?
Is it possible that some substrate got in them? If yes flush both eyes with a saline solution.
No, it is not a coil bulb. It is a long flourescent tube along the length of the enclosure. I have looked into his eyes and it does not seem to be substrate that is irritating them.
 

Tom

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Its sounds like you are doing everything right, but I learned something new from one of our other long term members who likes to argue with everything I say and try to refute all the advice I give.

I've used coco coir for years with all sorts of reptiles, but I've never used dry coir. I can't conceive of using coir and letting it dry out, so the concept was/is unfamiliar to me. The argumentative other member stated that dry coir gets dusty and can irritate the linings of the respiratory tract, and also the eyes, something I've never experienced because my coir is never dry.

So is your coir getting dry? Misting the surface does very little in most cases, and you need to be dumping water into the coir. I find it also helps to use a thick layer of coir and hand pack it so that it isn't so loose. I learned the other day that how a person uses the coir has everything to do with whether or not a person likes or dislikes the substrate. With a thick hand packed layer, you can keep the lower layers more damp, and the wicking effect will keep the upper layer from drying out and getting too loose or dusty.
 

Abby043

New Member
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Apr 22, 2017
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Its sounds like you are doing everything right, but I learned something new from one of our other long term members who likes to argue with everything I say and try to refute all the advice I give.

I've used coco coir for years with all sorts of reptiles, but I've never used dry coir. I can't conceive of using coir and letting it dry out, so the concept was/is unfamiliar to me. The argumentative other member stated that dry coir gets dusty and can irritate the linings of the respiratory tract, and also the eyes, something I've never experienced because my coir is never dry.

So is your coir getting dry? Misting the surface does very little in most cases, and you need to be dumping water into the coir. I find it also helps to use a thick layer of coir and hand pack it so that it isn't so loose. I learned the other day that how a person uses the coir has everything to do with whether or not a person likes or dislikes the substrate. With a thick hand packed layer, you can keep the lower layers more damp, and the wicking effect will keep the upper layer from drying out and getting too loose or dusty.
In some places it does get dry, especially on the warm/hot side. Weekly, I pour water in, mix it and pack it down. Your response made me realize that inside of his hideaway (which is a small pot on its side) that he sleeps in, he usually tries to push out the sphagnum moss and sleep in the coco coir and burrows himself down. It usually gets very dry in there. Do you think maybe creating a humid hide would help? Then it wouldn't be so dry where he sleeps/burrows? (If he decides to sleep in it!) I could try that today and see if he is doing better tomorrow.

Also, should those small white bugs not concern me?

He has been eating for about 20 minutes and his eyes seem a little less swollen and irritated. I think his basking light was a little too close so I raised it up.
 

Tom

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I do recommend humid hides for any species.

How much water and how often to add it does vary by enclosure and even changes with the seasons too. You'll need to add more and more often to avoid the dry spots.

It sounds to me like your basking area was just right at 90-100 degrees.

When I soak my tortoises, I have a little pump sprayer that I use to rinse them after their soak. It might help if you pay special attention to rinsing the eyes for a little while with this one.

I've never paid any attention to the little white or black substrate flies. They are harmless detrivores.
 
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