Do Redfoots lay eggs if they have not been bred?

MPRC

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I've always avoided female reptiles because I have a fear of egg binding. Now I have 2 female redfoots who are at or near sexual maturity and I can't find info anywhere as to if females produce eggs without being bred.

My largest female, Red, (9 years, ~10inches, 8lbs) has been pacing and kicking dirt around a lot. I can't tell if she's trying to tell me something or if she's just irritated to be indoors now that it's cooling off.

There is a small chance that Vern *could* have bred her sometime since we got her in August, but they have been primarily kept separate and I have not seen him successfully mount her.

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crimson_lotus

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I asked my vet the same question, she said yes they can lay infertile eggs, sometimes they don't and it gets reabsorbed
 

Tom

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Yes. Female red-footed tortoises that have reached sexual maturity can, and do lay infertile eggs even if never with a male.

Would it be safe to say that they can, but usually don't? This is the case with the species I keep, but is it the same with RFs, or are they more likely to lay when not bred?
 

cdmay

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Would it be safe to say that they can, but usually don't? This is the case with the species I keep, but is it the same with RFs, or are they more likely to lay when not bred?

I can't speak from personal experience but I do know several friends who've had captive hatched/raised females begin to lay eggs after about 8 or 10 years.
One interesting component of these experiences though is that in all cases there were multiple females that had been raised together. After they became mature at least one would begin mounting the other girls...now here's a question: did the female to female courtship cause a hormonal response that resulted in eggs being produced? Would those same females have produced eggs had they been in isolation? That I cannot answer.
 

Tom

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I can't speak from personal experience but I do know several friends who've had captive hatched/raised females begin to lay eggs after about 8 or 10 years.
One interesting component of these experiences though is that in all cases there were multiple females that had been raised together. After they became mature at least one would begin mounting the other girls...now here's a question: did the female to female courtship cause a hormonal response that resulted in eggs being produced? Would those same females have produced eggs had they been in isolation? That I cannot answer.

Fascinating stuff!
 

MPRC

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Would it be safe to say that they can, but usually don't? This is the case with the species I keep, but is it the same with RFs, or are they more likely to lay when not bred?

This was more my question. I didn't phrase it well. I wanted to know if they always make eggs or if its more of a fluke.

Red stopped scratching and digging late last night and hasn't started again. she's still eating like a pig which makes me think she's probably not full of eggs.

She did have a really soft BM this morning so now I'm just wondering if she found something to eat that maybe she shouldn't have.
 

Tom

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This was more my question. I didn't phrase it well. I wanted to know if they always make eggs or if its more of a fluke.

Red stopped scratching and digging late last night and hasn't started again. she's still eating like a pig which makes me think she's probably not full of eggs.

She did have a really soft BM this morning so now I'm just wondering if she found something to eat that maybe she shouldn't have.

I can't answer for RFs, but for all the species I do keep, they do not normally lay, if they have not been with a male. They certainly can, but they usually don't.
 

cdmay

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Whether or not lone female red-foot tortoises commonly produce eggs is a good question. Based on the small number of such females I know of that have produced eggs though, I can't make a definitive statement.
 

Redstrike

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I can't speak from personal experience but I do know several friends who've had captive hatched/raised females begin to lay eggs after about 8 or 10 years.
One interesting component of these experiences though is that in all cases there were multiple females that had been raised together. After they became mature at least one would begin mounting the other girls...now here's a question: did the female to female courtship cause a hormonal response that resulted in eggs being produced? Would those same females have produced eggs had they been in isolation? That I cannot answer.

I'm seeing this same behavior in my group and about 4-5 months ago one of my subadult females laid 8 eggs.
 

TammyJ

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This is so very interesting. So suppose you are not sure if the eggs are fertile or not? And could there be such a thing as parthenogenesis in turtles or tortoises, like in the Komodo Dragon?
 

cdmay

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This is so very interesting. So suppose you are not sure if the eggs are fertile or not? And could there be such a thing as parthenogenesis in turtles or tortoises, like in the Komodo Dragon?

Ha! I was waiting for someone to ask that question. Good one too. I'm not aware of parthenogenesis in chelonians. It has been demonstrated in several lizards as you mentioned, and at least a couple of snakes (= copperheads for sure, and I think a boa) that were live bearing species.
It is likely that no one bothers to incubate eggs from un-bred ('virgin') female turtles whereas live bearing snakes just sort of surprise you. As is in, "Hey, look what I did--- all by myself!"
 

MPRC

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So, Red stopped pacing and scratching for almost 6 weeks and now she is doing it again. She's been staying up later than the others, pacing, scratching with her back legs, standing with her butt up in the air.

I'm wondering if I don't have enough dirt, soft enough dirt, deep enough dirt etc.

We are in Oregon and stuck indoors and I'm worried about egg binding due to her not approving of conditions.

Any tips for making her an ideal nest box? Also, if it matters she has really weak back legs. When I got her in August, she didn't use them hardly at all. She's doing much better now and walks tall and only scoots if you put her on a hard surface.

Thanks in advance for any input you have. I wish I weren't so ill prepared.
 

MPRC

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Furthermore, I may be able to bring her in for xrays, but is it a worthwhile thing to do? I know my vet is NOT a tortoise specialist, but they have served me decently well with my other reptilian needs. I have emergency funds for just such an occasion, but aside from scratching she's acting normal, eating like a piggy, steadily increasing weight, etc
 

MPRC

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Does she feel heavier than usual?

It's hard to say since I've only had her since August and she came from a well meaning, but not great situation. She gained 9oz the first month we had her and she's gained 9 more since the end of September, but she was underfed and very dehydrated when we got her. So yes, she is more heavy, but I hae no idea if that's her gaining healthy normal weight or baby weight.
 

redfootHbadger

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So this happened tonight. I have two females from what I know both about 5 years old. She laid 8.
 

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Redstrike

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So this happened tonight. I have two females from what I know both about 5 years old. She laid 8.

Mine are of similar age and do the same.
I've not yet caught them in the act, but when I clean out there enclosure I often find eggs. I believe all 4 of mine are female.
 

Ehaley

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My 14 year old has laid 18 infertile eggs since February 2018. She never laid one once before. My younger female hasn't shown any signs she's going to start but she is only 8
 
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